Like many, I am trying to establish my first PM house.
Last year I put up the house about this time and I had tree swallows move in just before the PMs arrived. I didn't evict the TS but they certainly chased away some PMs. I have put up some bluebird type houses near the site (25') for the PM house, but they are unoccupied at this time. I don't want to be too late or too early. Are the PMs coming earlier this year due to the mild winter? It sounds like I should be considering putting the house back up soon...
FYI - I live in the northernmost part of Virginia.
When should I put my martin house back up?
mwolf,
I'd put the housing up now. If tree swallows move in, close your martin compartments until the swallows choose the house you have set up for them 25' or so away. Once they are bonded to that site, you can open your martin house back up. Good luck...
Patrick
I'd put the housing up now. If tree swallows move in, close your martin compartments until the swallows choose the house you have set up for them 25' or so away. Once they are bonded to that site, you can open your martin house back up. Good luck...
Patrick
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robndebby
- Posts: 119
- Joined: Sun Feb 20, 2005 1:25 pm
- Location: VIRGINIA/POWHATAN
- Martin Colony History: Established colony in 1990
Get that house up! I live northwest of Richmond in Powhatan, and I've had Martins for weeks now. They are already building their nests. Having problems with migrating hawks, but the Martins are still busy as they can be.
Put your house up and I bet you'll see them real soon. Good luck!
Put your house up and I bet you'll see them real soon. Good luck!
ROBNDEBBY
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CUL Lou~Mich
Mwolf00. I'd put the housing up, but block the holes, as has been suggested. Force the TS into their housing 25 to 35 feet away from the main PM housing area. Good Luck, those TS can be a real pain. CUL Lou
mwolf00,
It is not a completely safe thing to put queries on a message board, even though there is lots of good information and everyone who posts means well.
The problem of getting good coaching about TS interference is that many folks have not seen it... but don't know they have not seen it.
Even though Patrick's advice is good, advice from Texas is often sub-optimal since nobody in Texas has ever seen a tree swallow during their breeding season. Also, advice from an established PM site in your own state... or ANY established martins site should be ignored because tree swallow behavior at established martins sites is COMPLETELY DIFFERENT than what you are seeing... and what "ruined your year" last season.
[EDIT] In deference to Patrick's attack and assertions (below) I'll allow for the possibility that parts of Texas, since it is such a large state, might be included in the "wintering range" of the TS; though I have read and been told by more than one Texan that they never see them at all. The breeding territory of the TS definitely does NOT include Texas.
CUL Lou has the right idea; but you would benefit from understanding the details and the "why's" of what you are doing... and you need a means of recognizing and discarding all the "bad advice" that's out there about TS interference at an unestablished site.
The TS interference protocol I urge you to follow is at:
http://www.drugfreeworkplace.com/~Dan/E ... GENCY.html
You will find the answer to your question(s) there as well as a catalog of the most common "bad advice." If you have not already reviewed and/or implemented this, please consider doing that. You'll also see that there is "SOME TRUTH" in all the "bad advice" ...which makes the whole thing even more difficult... especially when all the advice is so well meant.
Please post again and let us all know how things turn out! Good luck! ~Dan
It is not a completely safe thing to put queries on a message board, even though there is lots of good information and everyone who posts means well.
The problem of getting good coaching about TS interference is that many folks have not seen it... but don't know they have not seen it.
Even though Patrick's advice is good, advice from Texas is often sub-optimal since nobody in Texas has ever seen a tree swallow during their breeding season. Also, advice from an established PM site in your own state... or ANY established martins site should be ignored because tree swallow behavior at established martins sites is COMPLETELY DIFFERENT than what you are seeing... and what "ruined your year" last season.
[EDIT] In deference to Patrick's attack and assertions (below) I'll allow for the possibility that parts of Texas, since it is such a large state, might be included in the "wintering range" of the TS; though I have read and been told by more than one Texan that they never see them at all. The breeding territory of the TS definitely does NOT include Texas.
CUL Lou has the right idea; but you would benefit from understanding the details and the "why's" of what you are doing... and you need a means of recognizing and discarding all the "bad advice" that's out there about TS interference at an unestablished site.
The TS interference protocol I urge you to follow is at:
http://www.drugfreeworkplace.com/~Dan/E ... GENCY.html
You will find the answer to your question(s) there as well as a catalog of the most common "bad advice." If you have not already reviewed and/or implemented this, please consider doing that. You'll also see that there is "SOME TRUTH" in all the "bad advice" ...which makes the whole thing even more difficult... especially when all the advice is so well meant.
Please post again and let us all know how things turn out! Good luck! ~Dan
Last edited by Dan Drew on Mon Apr 24, 2006 10:54 am, edited 1 time in total.
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klcretired
- Posts: 2174
- Joined: Tue Nov 18, 2003 3:06 am
- Location: Grand Prairie,Tx
mwolf00,
Welcome to the forum , we are glad to have you, I would have already had my Martin Housing up & Open sometimes the martins come in during the nite, you didn't mention anything about playing The Dawnsong, if you have it or can get it play it from 4:30 to 6:30 in the mornings also put a few decoys on your housing both of these are great Martin attracting tools.
Go to the scout report page on the main page and click on your State to see when other martin Landlord's are getting their bird's in your area.
I hope this info helps you and Good Luck this season.
Welcome to the forum , we are glad to have you, I would have already had my Martin Housing up & Open sometimes the martins come in during the nite, you didn't mention anything about playing The Dawnsong, if you have it or can get it play it from 4:30 to 6:30 in the mornings also put a few decoys on your housing both of these are great Martin attracting tools.
Go to the scout report page on the main page and click on your State to see when other martin Landlord's are getting their bird's in your area.
I hope this info helps you and Good Luck this season.
Pictures Taken with Canon Rebel XT Digital using a Sigma 50-500 Long Lens.
Wishing everyone a Great Martin Year
Happy Martining for 2022 to everyone,
K.C.
[email protected]
Wishing everyone a Great Martin Year
Happy Martining for 2022 to everyone,
K.C.
[email protected]
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Guest
Today, I observed a pair of TS building a nest in one of the boxes about 40 to 50' from the PM house site. I plan to put the PM house up tomorrow night or Tuesday! I don't have any music or decoys, but I have a very good site that seemed to attract a fair amount of PMs last year. Hopefully, I can get some to stay this year.
A side note: Thanks to all of you for offering your advice.
A second note: I have 3 pairs of TS/BB houses in my back yard. The one farthest from the PM site also has some activity. Last year I have a set of BB bring up their family there and I saw them again this year (no idea if they were the same ones or not). Well, today I saw some TS had moved into the house about 20' from the BB house and the BB and TS seemed to be at war. I think that the TSs are taking the whole area as their own. I found some BB feathers under the BB house and the TSs were dive-bombing the BB whenever he pearched nearby. I thought that they could all get along with that type of setup...
A side note: Thanks to all of you for offering your advice.
A second note: I have 3 pairs of TS/BB houses in my back yard. The one farthest from the PM site also has some activity. Last year I have a set of BB bring up their family there and I saw them again this year (no idea if they were the same ones or not). Well, today I saw some TS had moved into the house about 20' from the BB house and the BB and TS seemed to be at war. I think that the TSs are taking the whole area as their own. I found some BB feathers under the BB house and the TSs were dive-bombing the BB whenever he pearched nearby. I thought that they could all get along with that type of setup...
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Guest
So I put the house up on Monday afternoon. In the first 15 minutes a TS was checking it out. Next a BB was checking it out. After that, not too much activity on Monday evening. Tuesday morning was more of the same - BBs and TSs were checking it out. Finally, at about 9 AM, 2 PMs were looking at it. Of course, this raised the curiosity of the TSs who pestered the PMs the whole time. By 10AM, I had witnessed a pair of TSs attack a BB who landed on the house and I knew that they were claiming it as their own (it turns out the nest that I thought was TSs was actually BBs and I saw a TS leaving it after checking it out while the BBs were away).
I immediately put up a new BB house 25' from the site. By the time I walked from there to the site, the TSs were already checking out the new house. I took the PM house down and watched as the TSs and BBs both checked out the new house. By evening the TSs had taken over. I will wait about 3 days to see what transpires, but I'm guessing that the TSs will nest in the new house and then I can remount the PM house this weekend...
I immediately put up a new BB house 25' from the site. By the time I walked from there to the site, the TSs were already checking out the new house. I took the PM house down and watched as the TSs and BBs both checked out the new house. By evening the TSs had taken over. I will wait about 3 days to see what transpires, but I'm guessing that the TSs will nest in the new house and then I can remount the PM house this weekend...
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CUL Lou~Mich
Mwolf00. I'm NOT sure three days is enough. The TS need to be committed to their assigned housing PRIOR to the PM housing being put up and opened. Committed in my mind means at least one eggs laid. And yes, I have had problems with TS, so I have seen it. CUL Lou
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Guest
Thanks Lou,
If the TSs started yesterday - how long until they build a nest and have eggs?
How long can I wait before I miss the PMs?
Mike
If the TSs started yesterday - how long until they build a nest and have eggs?
How long can I wait before I miss the PMs?
Mike
mwolf00,
I can tell from your posts that you are very eager and very much in a hurry! [The birds do not share this eagerness and will work at their own pace.] I can also tell that you read the protocol in a hurry also. Please go back and read it in leisurely detail:
http://www.drugfreeworkplace.com/~Dan/E ... GENCY.html
It is not an easy read; but it will make your job easier... and improve your chances of getting martins.
By the way, you are now in STEP 3 of the protocol; so you should have a scarcity of TS/BB housing over whatever area you control. You should remove all unoccupied TS/BB housing except for the "designated BB and TS cavities up close to your "shut down" PM rig. (25 - 35 ft.)
It sounds like your TS pair have "fixed" on the designated cavity you put out; so you might be "on your way" with step 3. If so you simply need to wait for their "committment" to the designated cavity. You should expect that to take a lot more than 3 days... and you will have to be patient and ride the teeter totter until you see a TS egg in the nest.
If you are not successful getting martins this year... i.e. if you aren't expecting site-loyal returning martins next year, you should begin this protocol in late march when the TS return. It's amazing how much time you will save by using the protocol PROactively.
Good luck!
Dan
I can tell from your posts that you are very eager and very much in a hurry! [The birds do not share this eagerness and will work at their own pace.] I can also tell that you read the protocol in a hurry also. Please go back and read it in leisurely detail:
http://www.drugfreeworkplace.com/~Dan/E ... GENCY.html
It is not an easy read; but it will make your job easier... and improve your chances of getting martins.
By the way, you are now in STEP 3 of the protocol; so you should have a scarcity of TS/BB housing over whatever area you control. You should remove all unoccupied TS/BB housing except for the "designated BB and TS cavities up close to your "shut down" PM rig. (25 - 35 ft.)
It sounds like your TS pair have "fixed" on the designated cavity you put out; so you might be "on your way" with step 3. If so you simply need to wait for their "committment" to the designated cavity. You should expect that to take a lot more than 3 days... and you will have to be patient and ride the teeter totter until you see a TS egg in the nest.
If you are not successful getting martins this year... i.e. if you aren't expecting site-loyal returning martins next year, you should begin this protocol in late march when the TS return. It's amazing how much time you will save by using the protocol PROactively.
Good luck!
Dan
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Guest
Dan,
I am seeing that your protocol is accurate so far. I guess my confusion comes at the point of putting up my PM house. If the TSs choose a site and build a nest, will they abandon it for the PM house because they haven't laid eggs yet? I read your points system to determine their level of commitment but it seems strange that they would abandon a nesting site that they have worked on for days (weeks?) in order to pick a new place and start all over just because they haven't laid eggs yet.
I do appreciate the time you've taken to make that page and to respond to my posts here. Yes, I am impatient as I don't want to miss out again this year. I don't know how big the "window of opportunity" is here. Unfortunately, I cannot got back to March and force the TS into the boxes I want them in now. I did have a set of boxes up for them in March but I live in an area where there are many dead trees with holes that are perfect for them. I cannot possibly force them to the desired house. Fortunately, there seems to be an abundance of TSs here so that one pair will nest in one of the boxes in the proximity of the PM site. I will do the best I can to wait for the TSs to lay eggs, but I'm wondering how long that will take and how much time that leaves for the PMs...
I am seeing that your protocol is accurate so far. I guess my confusion comes at the point of putting up my PM house. If the TSs choose a site and build a nest, will they abandon it for the PM house because they haven't laid eggs yet? I read your points system to determine their level of commitment but it seems strange that they would abandon a nesting site that they have worked on for days (weeks?) in order to pick a new place and start all over just because they haven't laid eggs yet.
I do appreciate the time you've taken to make that page and to respond to my posts here. Yes, I am impatient as I don't want to miss out again this year. I don't know how big the "window of opportunity" is here. Unfortunately, I cannot got back to March and force the TS into the boxes I want them in now. I did have a set of boxes up for them in March but I live in an area where there are many dead trees with holes that are perfect for them. I cannot possibly force them to the desired house. Fortunately, there seems to be an abundance of TSs here so that one pair will nest in one of the boxes in the proximity of the PM site. I will do the best I can to wait for the TSs to lay eggs, but I'm wondering how long that will take and how much time that leaves for the PMs...
Strange as it may seem, THEY WILL... especially if your PM cavities are HIGH above the ground. TS are the "sentinels of the swllow world" and tend to prefer the highest thing around... for both breeding and perching.it seems strange that they would abandon a nesting site that they have worked on for days
I would be surprised to see a fully feathered nest in a new TS cavity sooner than a week... but I am willing to be surprised and I hope the birds will work even faster for you as the SY's are already arriving in our latitudes.
If you're there and watching, you can open the PM housing so as not to deny access to investigating PM's... but you must "ride the teeter totter" and not leave the PM housing open with your back turned on those TS... or they WILL invade your PM cavities.
There is no "trick" to speed things up for you now... and it seems to me you must "surrender" to the fact that you are "running late" and that compromises your chances for martins this year. Your "window of opportunity" is short this year because the martins are already here. But do the best you can [It is STILL POSSIBLE THIS YEAR] ...and I will pray you are successful this year. Next year, you will know how to "beat the calendar" by starting the protocol earlier.