Thanks Dale.
R. C?Your right about not having enough housing up. At the beginning of the season I had added one T-14 and thought that would be plenty only having 8 pairs last year. As they filled I ordered an 8-gourd fountain rack that was filled in about 7 days.
I am retired and my wife and I did nest checks every 2 to 3 days and have very good records. I think that because you have never had this happen at your colony is a very poor reason to imply someone is being dishonest when they answer a simple question. I had a wonderful season, posted lots of pics., went to martin-fest, met some great folks, and 43 of 44 cavities did have fledges.
Curious - Are any houses or gourds ever at capacity?
Here's a great recent thread that also discusses martin occuapancy levels in different types of housing:
http://www.purplemartin.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=578
http://www.purplemartin.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=578
-
Guest
this year i had 100% in my T-14 with 4 troyer gourds and 100% in two M-12s on the multipurpose pole with four super gourds and about 50% in a barn type S&K house
jason
jason
-
1 Ron Vasser
- Posts: 584
- Joined: Sun Apr 18, 2004 8:26 pm
- Location: Georgia/Rome
Great #s Jason! I'm sure that male dominance is an issue at some colonies but so far I've not had this behavior in my colony. In this pic. the only cavity without babies is the top facing in the purple house. The martin housing is not as close to my house as it appears in the pic.
Ron
-
Guest
Ron, Great setup. I have natural gourds hanging under my t14 like you and was wondering how you manage to keep yours so clean. I think my wife is on the verge of telling me to take mine down.
Edit:
Just think I answered my own question - in your case the gourds are farther away from the house.
Edit:
Just think I answered my own question - in your case the gourds are farther away from the house.
-
Guest
Ron,
I assure you that I am very jealous of your success!!!
I love your pics so please keep posting them. It sounds like the T-14 is ideal at your location.
HogWild
Darryl
I assure you that I am very jealous of your success!!!
I love your pics so please keep posting them. It sounds like the T-14 is ideal at your location.
HogWild
Darryl
-
Guest
Hey now I just read Tony's comment.
Maybe I will stick with the T14 and not add any more housing. Heck if I can not count to 14 how can ever manage more martins.
Great for laugh thanks for the firery comment Tony
Maybe I will stick with the T14 and not add any more housing. Heck if I can not count to 14 how can ever manage more martins.
Great for laugh thanks for the firery comment Tony
-
Guest
RC, Sounds interesting, are you using regular style porches or closed in enrtrance areas? Have you actually tried the house out? Could you post a picture of the finished house.
What are you using for material? Is it styrofoam?
What are you using for material? Is it styrofoam?
Dale, when I had one and two houses up years ago I too had 100% for a while. I glad you and others get 100% and hope never experience any of the problems I have. But Like I said IMO I don't want it and there are reasons that I guess only pretant to me. One is with 100% somebody gets booted or worse when the dreaded E. sparrow or starling calls. I have found that most of the time but not always the intruders will take the empty cavity which usually give me time to offer the intruder a lead lunch or a S. Joe Az. hotel. When I say IMO that means I probably the only one that thinks like this.
Stan after seeing picture on the forum of staggered hole a couple of years ago I tried it. the old picture of a t-10 that I had to show the stagger porches. I have since made T-14 with internal baffles and have removed the outside block off baffles. I like the L shaped nesting compartments do it complete hides the nest chamber. I also noticed with the internal baffles on the straight holes it blocks vision of the nest chamber and the martin sometimes perch up on the top of the baffles when I've done nest checks. I have to take some more pictures and reduce them with my antique camera and system.
Stan after seeing picture on the forum of staggered hole a couple of years ago I tried it. the old picture of a t-10 that I had to show the stagger porches. I have since made T-14 with internal baffles and have removed the outside block off baffles. I like the L shaped nesting compartments do it complete hides the nest chamber. I also noticed with the internal baffles on the straight holes it blocks vision of the nest chamber and the martin sometimes perch up on the top of the baffles when I've done nest checks. I have to take some more pictures and reduce them with my antique camera and system.
Ron, you have a great neat looking set up, time it takes to manage, records, and evidently no problems and my trailor trash set up will never achieve that. As on any forum you get answers you don't want to hear, (In My Opinion (IMO) I see 100% not a good thing based on problems I have had in the pass. I could probably remove one house and probably could have the 100% thing for a while, but I have learned on this forum and in my area it better on me and the martins to offer at least 15 to 20% more holes that occupied. Even with that I lost 6 Pairs this year.
-
Dale Hrncirik
robndebby,
I had 100% occupancy in 2004 at my colony in Wylie Tx. It was my 7th year and the best of all for the record books. I offered mainly SGs, natural gourds, a few bo villas, a big bo and a bo gourd(thanks to Dave's kindness). All 25 rooms contained active nests but 2 ended up as nest failures since the eggs didn't hatch. The tally sheet reads 148 eggs laid, 130 hatched and 126 fledged. We were able to band 119 nestlings on 6-01-2004 which was all but 2 nests. The probable reason for 100% occupancy at my site was the fact that I had downsized my colony from 31 pairs in 2003 since my next door neighbor with a pool made such a fuss.
I believe that gourds spaced a good distance apart(i.e. ~ 18") are quite capable of getting full occupancy in a mature colony. All my birds were ASYs which really helps in the final numbers.
Unlike RC Moser, I don't feel that 100% occupancy is a bad thing. Reason being, I offer plenty of nest box traps to lure the S&S away from my martin housing. I don't want any S&S even thinking of setting up shop in a vacant PM cavity. That logic makes no sense to me. I either trap and/or shoot the pest birds before they pose any problems.
Dale
I had 100% occupancy in 2004 at my colony in Wylie Tx. It was my 7th year and the best of all for the record books. I offered mainly SGs, natural gourds, a few bo villas, a big bo and a bo gourd(thanks to Dave's kindness). All 25 rooms contained active nests but 2 ended up as nest failures since the eggs didn't hatch. The tally sheet reads 148 eggs laid, 130 hatched and 126 fledged. We were able to band 119 nestlings on 6-01-2004 which was all but 2 nests. The probable reason for 100% occupancy at my site was the fact that I had downsized my colony from 31 pairs in 2003 since my next door neighbor with a pool made such a fuss.
I believe that gourds spaced a good distance apart(i.e. ~ 18") are quite capable of getting full occupancy in a mature colony. All my birds were ASYs which really helps in the final numbers.
Unlike RC Moser, I don't feel that 100% occupancy is a bad thing. Reason being, I offer plenty of nest box traps to lure the S&S away from my martin housing. I don't want any S&S even thinking of setting up shop in a vacant PM cavity. That logic makes no sense to me. I either trap and/or shoot the pest birds before they pose any problems.
Dale
-
Emil Pampell-Tx
- Posts: 6743
- Joined: Tue Nov 11, 2003 1:26 pm
- Location: Tx, Richmond (SW of Houston)
- Martin Colony History: First started in Gretna, La in 1969 with a small homemade house, have had martins ever since at 2 different homes in Texas
RC, its impossible, or nearly impossible, for me to offer 20% more housing than they need, because it's too many martins here. I would need to add about 200 gourds to do that, and I certainly don't want any more than I already have. Then next year, I would need to add 400, etc..It just is not feasible!
Your idea may be good for small colonies, but not at my place!
Your idea may be good for small colonies, but not at my place!
PMCA Member, 250 gourds, 6 poles, 2traps
Well, guess we do what works for us 
. I don't plan on getting any bigger either. Go room for about 36 pairs. I figure the more you get the more problems you encounter, at least that is the trend I have encountered.
I have too many sparrows and starlings and usually work at least 10 hours a day
. I had as many as 34 pairs early in the season till hawks got 4 or ran them off and the S & S ran off 2 pair before I got home one day. Yes, I got two types of traps and haven't missed two invader (S or S) that I got a bead on for two years (56 to 2).
My posts are MY opinions not by no means are the norm especially when gourds are used or do I expect everyone to agree (if fact the more we disagree the more inputs we get on a subject, like this one IMO). At one point early in my PMs experience I wanted to get 100 pairs. Now that I encoutered some of the grief and disappointments 20 to 30 pairs is more than enough for me.
. I don't plan on getting any bigger either. Go room for about 36 pairs. I figure the more you get the more problems you encounter, at least that is the trend I have encountered. I have too many sparrows and starlings and usually work at least 10 hours a day
. I had as many as 34 pairs early in the season till hawks got 4 or ran them off and the S & S ran off 2 pair before I got home one day. Yes, I got two types of traps and haven't missed two invader (S or S) that I got a bead on for two years (56 to 2). My posts are MY opinions not by no means are the norm especially when gourds are used or do I expect everyone to agree (if fact the more we disagree the more inputs we get on a subject, like this one IMO). At one point early in my PMs experience I wanted to get 100 pairs. Now that I encoutered some of the grief and disappointments 20 to 30 pairs is more than enough for me.
-
Dale Hrncirik
RC,
I kinda understand what you are saying. I don't plan on offering more than ~ 22 cavities for the martins. I also would like to see them full of martins rather than leaving a few available for the pest birds. I work long hours and 6 days a week so I have missed a lot of martin watching this year. That's the reason I have 5 nestbox traps to catch the vermin. Once you get close or at 100%, catching the S&S is usually very easy with traps and a mature colony of site tenacious martins. I'm not there yet as I only had 5 pairs of SYs at my new 1st year site so I had to do a little shooting to control the sparrows. I would like to be at or near capacity in 3-4 years and don't plan on growing my site at that time. I'm in an HOA and don't need any grief like I had in the past. I just don't believe that having a few vacant cavities available for the S&S is a good thing. You like me are entitled to our own opinions so I do respect that. I wish you the best!
Dale
I kinda understand what you are saying. I don't plan on offering more than ~ 22 cavities for the martins. I also would like to see them full of martins rather than leaving a few available for the pest birds. I work long hours and 6 days a week so I have missed a lot of martin watching this year. That's the reason I have 5 nestbox traps to catch the vermin. Once you get close or at 100%, catching the S&S is usually very easy with traps and a mature colony of site tenacious martins. I'm not there yet as I only had 5 pairs of SYs at my new 1st year site so I had to do a little shooting to control the sparrows. I would like to be at or near capacity in 3-4 years and don't plan on growing my site at that time. I'm in an HOA and don't need any grief like I had in the past. I just don't believe that having a few vacant cavities available for the S&S is a good thing. You like me are entitled to our own opinions so I do respect that. I wish you the best!
Dale
WOW Dale, 5 traps, I guess I need to build me a couple of more this winter. Sounds like you job is worse than mine 
I post some off the wall thinking sometimes 
and it's not directed at anybody, just sometimes where you get in line in a post. I have learned alot here and enjoy all the different ideas or thoughts.
Stan, when I remove My T-14 I will take some pictures of it and the slide out nesting trays with block off baffles hiding the nesting chamber if your still interested. As for materials I use 1/2" plywood with 1 by 10 backs. The block off plates I had up a couple of years ago was Vinly siding. As far as my restrictor plates I'm down to one design which has to be PM tested as I never seen any enter the final design beings I got it up late in the season. I have one other that works, but I didn't like how the babies hung there heads out the slots of the wings, so I'm abandoning that one for now.
I post some off the wall thinking sometimes and it's not directed at anybody, just sometimes where you get in line in a post. I have learned alot here and enjoy all the different ideas or thoughts. Stan, when I remove My T-14 I will take some pictures of it and the slide out nesting trays with block off baffles hiding the nesting chamber if your still interested. As for materials I use 1/2" plywood with 1 by 10 backs. The block off plates I had up a couple of years ago was Vinly siding. As far as my restrictor plates I'm down to one design which has to be PM tested as I never seen any enter the final design beings I got it up late in the season. I have one other that works, but I didn't like how the babies hung there heads out the slots of the wings, so I'm abandoning that one for now.
-
Guest
Rc, It would be great to see the details of your house. I have had male dominance with t14's from the day I put them up and would like to find ways of improving on them.
I am experimenting with 1/2" blue styrofoam laminated with vinyl. I have been getting advice from Bernie Nikolai and would like to try this material out with all types of houses. Hopefully I will be able to construct a durable t14 weighing in the 25-40 pound range.
I am experimenting with 1/2" blue styrofoam laminated with vinyl. I have been getting advice from Bernie Nikolai and would like to try this material out with all types of houses. Hopefully I will be able to construct a durable t14 weighing in the 25-40 pound range.