So I have had 10 jumpers in 2 days..Have some questions

[John Evans]

Please..
So this is my 3rd year as a landlord at this location. I have been a landlord on and off for many years. I have a total of 48 gourds I am using mostly Troyer Horizontal with conely 2 entrances.

As the subject heading posts I have been watching babys not fledge but being pulled off or harassed off the porches by SY birds. Not that that might be unusual (harassment that is) but, it is weird that the young are out and even hoping on top of the gourds.

I gave up replacing the young in their gourds after 3 I put in jumped back out before the rack was raised, I have 36 gourds that are days apart from fledge and will not disturb them anymore. Most of the young that were pushed learned to fly eventually after spending time on the ground.

There is plenty of food, good weather and no nest mites or flies. (confirmed when I lowered the rack yesterday).

So my big question of the day is could it be the porches? Possibly detrimental to young? This is the first year gourds with 5 young. Are the gourds not large enough Also these are all ASY pairs.Grasping for straws

Sorry this a strange question Thank you!

[John Evans]

Or just the runts of the brood?

[Louise Chambers]

How old are the jumpers, do you know? You could use plug & string method, that way they cannot jump again while you raise the systems.

Are the nests wet? You can't always tell by looking, may need to burrow down with fingers. We found mushrooms growing out the bottom drain holes of a gourd today - and it's not been that wet, either.

[John Evans]

Thanks Louise,
the jumpers are almost ready to fledge and some have actually flown away off the ground after a few hours . Some birds are day or so away. Nests don't appear to be wet although I have not burrowed down. I have seen birds pulled off there porches when the parents are away. With this long weekend had plenty of time to watch. Got 2 more on the ground tonight. Never seen this before.
They are coming out of different nests. If it was the same nest or 2 I could investigate further. But I will have to wait till the season ends and see what I find.

There are so many ready to fledge from different gourds I was afraid to add the extra time preparing the plug and string method..


Thanks.

[John Evans]

one more point.. Last official nest check was June 16. No sign of mite then but dusted again with sevin. This is happening at 2 of my 5 racks. Wife reports 3 more on the ground this morning although 1 left for the skies after a while. In about another week, I'll lower the racks and do a through bug inspection. Almost has to be bugs and the SY's are just taking advantage of the babies on the porches.

With the 3 today and 2 last night that's 15 in 3 days. The 2 last night were resting this morning about half way up our pasture fence. They were from 2 different gourds and adults were over on the fence last night as well..

[Chris B]

I have not had any jumpers from the larger gourds with the SREH and porches. My jumpers are from the 2" hole gourds with no porches. I had another round of jumping this weekend. Some I would pick up and gently stroke on their backs to calm them down and then try to put back in the gourd. A few flew away. Two went downhill and I was able to find one that evening in tall grass at the corner of my building. He was going back in when he flew away in a different direction toward some trees. I have not seen him again.

The other I found the next morning in tall grass next to the building as I was mowing it. This guy had been in the grass all night. It had rained. he was wet and probably scared to death from the fireworks. I walked up to my porch with him in my hand clinging to my finger as I stroked him. I sat there with him in my hand stroking his back and he went to sleep! After a while I put him in a gourd that I knew still had babies so he at least would get fed. Didn't see his head poking out this morning so who knows.

The fireworks scare the birds for sure judging from what I see with the young barnies. BTW, the 5 that were in the 2nd nest fledged yesterday, so 2 successful nests so far with the first going on round 2. Those barnies are real bug eaters for sure.

[pmlover]

im getting about ten jumpers a day now its just the time the parents are shoving them out. its almost comical to watch them, however knowing me I worry all the time about them.
dick

[John Evans]

Thanks Dick.. Some of yours fly off later while on the ground or do they just hop away? The parents refuse to feed them while they are on the ground. I tossed 3 into the trees last night at least the parents had a chance to feed them.

Our boxer as big a goof as she is just wants to play with them. They don't want to play with her. So trying to keep the dog away is a challenge!

[Louise Chambers]

Martin nestlings typically fledge at 26-28 days old. If they end up on the ground, it's not normal - that's one reason parents won't feed a grounded nestling, it's not supposed to be on the ground. The jumpers/fall-outs are either hungry, hot, or trying to escape mite infestations.

Porches may encourage young birds to come out before they are really ready to fly, and they can get knocked off of the porches by SY males. Before srehs were widely used on gourds, gourds did not have porches - maybe that was better - but heat and mites can be dealt with, and if insects are in short supply, supplemental feeding can help, too.

It's likely the jumpers are thinner than their sibs, and maybe they are the runts of their broods.

[Chris B]

That little guy that spent the night out in the rain in the tall grass was way too small. Other jumpers seemed to be able to fly OK, at least as long as the ground was sloping away.

It makes mowing a real hassle as you have to keep a eye out for birds in the tall grass around things, as that's where they hide.

[Chris B]

Yesterday evening I noticed 3 PMs on my rock driveway as I came back from feeding the fish in the ponds. Two adults flew off but the youngster stayed there. After a while I picked him up and his wingtips were a little over 3/4" shorter than the tailfeather tips - way too small. After riding him on my finger looking for a good gourd to put him into the adults were on the power lines just watching. I took him down to a SREH porch gourd that had birds still in it and put him in there. I think the 2" round hole gourds are done and he needs food.

He had little bugs around his head that I wiped off. It was kinda cool that he would raise his wings by leaning left and right so I could also get under there. Looks like I will have to do better next year with mites in the 2" round gourds which are hard to prenest. Maybe some diatomatious (sp?) earth.

[twins]

my gourds are all over water never thought of them jumping out of nest i hope they can fly a little when they leave

[John Evans]

They will swim (flutter) back to shore.. Some of my young get driven down by the adults into the water. I saw one the other day motor back at least 100 feet. Don't believe I've actually had one drown.

[JoeD]

Hi, I have lots of babies fall to the ground or barely able to fly. Maybe 20 to 30 (3 -5 a day over the past week). I have about 40+ pairs for past 35-40 years. I do not consider these jumpers as they are at or just past the fledging date. These birds are weak, thin, and cannot get airborne. Eventho we have had relatively good weather all spring there has been a very noticeable lack of flying insects and I have been concerned about this for the past month or so and now my fears are being realized. My colony is well managed with no wet nest of mites. I have had big loses before but all have been weather related. My hunch is that it is related pesticide use or an interruption in the feeding for a few days of cool weather which may adversely impacted there development. It seems like more than few are having the same problem
Thanks, JoeD

[Chris B]

I kind of wonder if the barnies are hogging all the flying bugs, but then again I see dragonflies around the ponds so there IS food to be had.

What can I do when returning a runt to a gourd if I see little insects on him? Can I dab a little seven on the bird somewhere?

[John Evans]

First day in 4 no jumpers. Probably had at least 15 the last few days. Some were able to leave the ground after a while, others headed to the woods.
I am also wondering if weather has played a problem here. We have had a very wet somewhat cooler June a very critical period for my colony. I have 3 ponds and not many dragonflies. I have witnessed some large bugs being carried into the gourds but have had a noticeable lack of pesky bugs on our land. We chalked it up at the time to good martin work but reconsidering that thought based on comments from other landlords in the region.

The last 2 winters have been harsh and there may be a correlation. Who knows.

We had a fairly large Jap Beetle hatch a week or so ago and witnessed many martins skimming the ground picking off the beetles. Saw some females returning to feed their young 5 to 6 times a minute.But that only last about a week.
Hope I have about 90 or so young to fledge 20 or 30 have left the nest already.
Maybe the ecosystem this year has not been able to support the jump in our martin population this year? Also have a dozen or so tree swallows and a few Barnies. Maybe too many to support... Have a lot to ponder.

Great discussion Thanks for the contributions!

John

[birdbrat]

John, I just read your post and I am so sorry to hear about your troubles. I have had a few jumpers, but not that many. The usual reason here seems to be the lack of insects. I have had several older babies hanging out of the boxes or gourds, only to find that if I feed the adults they in turn feed the babies, which then settle down and go back inside. Don't get me wrong. I do think it is normal behavior for the little ones to stay at the door to get fed. But if they are really hungry they will lean too far and fall. Some may catch themselves and get to the top of compartments or perches. I think that is when you see older birds knocking and pulling them down. Perhaps trying to get them to fledge. It seems that once they are old and strong enough to be in the air for the first time, the adult birds (usually in groups) keep after them for quite a while before they allow them to land. Could it be that we are seeing adults trying to fledge weak, hungry babies? I do know that most of the ones that I have picked up here have been just a day or two away from flying. I know it's tough, and if I thought I could help you out, I'd be there with bells on. If you are like me, at the end of the year you will looking at those compartments to see if there are any improvements to be made to make it a better season next year.

[John Evans]

Thanks birdbrat. I like your logic. What I think might be a reasonable feeding window between storms this year may not have helped keep the babies feed.
That may explain some of the jumpers. Thank you for your encouragement.
Always learning something every season and the invaluable resource of discussion and commitment of the wonderful landlords here is incredible!

Yes I will analyze this season like I have the past years and figure out how to do it better. I already have a feeding tray from the PMCA here that I will install next season.

Take care

[birdbrat]

I have a feed tray here that we made and it works very well. However, when I had the extra birds show up I took it down and used the pole to put up a box to give them a place to roost. I ended up feeding from a 10 foot board held in place between 2 step ladders. Something else to move each time I mow, but it works. Good luck, and keep us posted.

[John Evans]

No jumpers that we have noticed since July 6. So what ever was causing the first fledglings to jump has settled down. Can't yet determine how many have left but over half (60) would be a guess. Still a lot of cooler rainy weather this week and the next week as well. Not been much of a summer.

Lots of birds coming back in the evening,so much fun to watch them all settle in for the night. Not many more weeks for that.