Liquid Seven

[DAVE]

I have a Question about soaking Gourds in a Liquid Seven solution instead of 20 percent Clorox at the end of the Martin season. I have had real problems with Mites this year. Did 6 nest changes . Last year only one. I removed the 6 Gourds after the Fledglings left their nest because the mites came back with a vengeance and I was afraid that 2 ASY Males that where using 2 of them might spread them to other Gourds. Doing this upset the 2 Males but I figured it was for the best. At the end of every Martin season I would clean out the nests and soak each Gourd in 20 percent Clorox solution about 20 minutes each and hang to dry then put Seven dust in all of them. For some reason this did not seem to work well. Because the Gourd I did the nest change in last year was the first to have the Mites.
So I need some good feed back.
Thanks Dave

[Emil Pampell-Tx]

Sevin lasts only about 10 days if you use a liquid mix. If you use a powder, it only lasts about 10 days after it gets damp or wet. Clorox should kill the mites, but I never tried sevin at the end of the season

Applying sevin dust at the end of the season may not do any good at all.

What most people do is put in the sevin when they hang the gourds in the spring, or before the eggs are hatched, or even after they see mites. Either of these methods work good but the nest may get infected again. This could happen many ways, but a common idea is that sparrows coming to visit could infest a nest. If the mites start again, apply sevin again. I too have had to apply sevin a 2nd time in some years, but usually 1 application is sufficient. How quickly you get mites somewhat depends upon the weather. The mites blossom quickly during wet and damp periods.

Nest changes can be done to help control the mites, but you do not get rid of them. Any mites that remain after the nest change can blossom into a problem again. If you like this method, you should do nest changes as soon as you see mites in the nest for best results.

I keep it simple, I hose out the gourds at the end of the season, and apply about 1/2 teaspoon of sevin dust before I hang the gourds in the spring. That is sufficient most years as I seldom need to do anything else.

[John & Linda - KY]

I also apply Sevin dust before raising my gourds in the spring. It's interesting to watch the martins scratch and peck at themselves when they first come back. After a couple of days going in and out of gourds that stops for the rest of the season. -- John

[R Onnen]

Last year, I put sevin in when I raised houses, and had mites later in the season. This year waited till nest building started and have not had any more mites. GREAT YEAR

[DAVE]

I am just wondering if there will be any long term effect. I have all Natural Gourds with a soft natural lining inside. This lining could be where they are hiding.
Thanks for the quick reply's. Dave

[wyatt]

That's the elephant in the room Dave. I think the average life-span of a martin is 7 years, and sevin has been used much longer than that without any noticeable adverse effects. I believe most of us have decided to use it, but it's a decision everyone will have to make for themselves.

[CurtWelling]

Virtually all wild birds have mites. It's not overwintering mites or mites from sparrows that get in the gourds but mites from purple martins.

[Emil Pampell-Tx]

Curt, I would think that mites can get into the gourds from any birds that land on the housing, mites are not limited to only purple martins. If the nests were recently treated with sevin, then the resident purple martins may not have mites.

[CurtWelling]

My opinion is that mites are even harder to eliminate than starlings or sparrows. They are a fact of life. Goal should be control. You could boil your gourds for a week in the off season and you will still have mites in them next summer.

[Siberman]

Do y'all put the dust on bare floor compartments or just under nesting material ?

[Emil Pampell-Tx]

It can be put nearly anywhere. I seldom see bare floors, as most of the gourds have nesting material when I check them, I add nesting material before I hang them. I like to put the sevin under the nesting material. The sevin dust is so effective, you can put it on the porch on a dry day, the martins will get it on their feet and take some in, and the mites will disappear, but in any case such as putting it on the porch, it does control the mites.

It is so simple, any method works. I have heard of putting it along the outside edges, on the edges of the tunnels, just anywhere works. Wherever you put it should not be an issue

[tonyg]

What Emil said.....Nuff said...

[John Miller]

Sevin is a poison and while I use it sparingly, I try my best to avoid direct contact with the martins as a precaution, so I try to tap it down into the nest sides and use only about one-fourth teaspoon total, or if the nest can be lifted up, I work some under it. Many people prefer to just do nest changes, and sometimes I do a nest change and before putting in fresh material, just add a little sevin under the fresh nest material.

[DAVE]

What I was really asking if you soak the Gourds after the Martin season is over in Liquid Seven instead of Clorox solution would this kill off any Mites that are still in the Gourds and would there be any Seven residue come next Spring that would hurt the Birds. I do use Seven Dust but we have had a lot of rain this year, about 12 inches more than usual and real hot weather. I also found Mites on the poles and Predator Guards. It's been a real fight.
Thanks Dave
Sorry about the confusion

[barry resvick]

I used diatomatous earth this year for the first time and had no blow fly problems or mites.It works even when wet,Its completely natural with no chemicals and really raises hell with any parasites.It doesn't lose it effectiveness over time.

[John Miller]

Dave

I doubt anyone here knows for sure. We're not pesticide experts nor even experts on the life cycle of mites. We make judgment calls, and mine would be to use a bleach solution, maybe a little stronger than the recommended 10 percent. You are not just trying to kill adult mites, but the eggs and larva, and maybe bleach would do that, and hopefully the chorline would dissipate by spring. Not sure how much liquid sevin residue might remain in the natural gourd and whether it might leach into a wet nest in spring, but seems worrisome to me if you really soaked the gourd in it.

It may also help to drill bigger drain holes in your natural gourds....it not only drains better but lets more air in the bottom so nest may dry out better and be less favorable for mites. And maybe consider if water is leaking in the hanging holes as well.

John Miller

[DAVE]

Thanks to all who posted. John! I think you are probably right about using Clorox. I think I'll keep using it. As for the Seven, it will soak the inside real good. I just wasn't sure how long it would stay active. With your Post and thinking more that it is probably best to not take a chance.
Over all this year I have had a very good season. 103 eggs, 101 Hatchings and still11 more to Fledge. It' been a lot of hard work and worry but well worth it. Good luck too all.
Thanks Dave

[DebA]

Awesome season, Dave! I don't have any Sevin fears. I'm pretty sure whatever people use Goldbond powder for they could substitute Sevin. Hehe.
Deb

[art]

Dave,
Museums with study skins of stuffed birds always deal with Dermestid beetle infestations. Dermestid larvae feed on dried protein (skin, feathers, fur, muscle tissue) and if not controlled will complete destroy a specimen. Even seen an insect collection reduced to dust?? That's dermestids at work. Museums now put study specimens in the deep freeze for 48 hours. At KU and Michigan, student aids work full time rotating study skins of mammals and birds through numerous freezers to kill any dermestid larvae. Do you have a chest freezer with some empty space? At the end of season put a gourd or two in plastic bag and freeze for two days. Try this as an experiment this year and compare results with you control group (unfrozen) of gourds next season. Do you live in a warm region where mites may survive the winter?

[Louise Chambers]

Mites and fleas both successfully overwintered in old martin nests in NW Pennsylvania - one of the projects the PMCA undertook was to determine if and how many nest parasites could survive northern winters if old nests were left in housing. The answer was lots of them! Another reason why the PMCA recommends removing old nests after the season ends. Mites will still survive, as many pack into crevices in housing - so a spray of soapy water and some bleach are suggested, too.