Hunt for second PM House - Recommendations Please

[msalcido]

I'm learning there are so many different housing options. I'm dumbfounded as to which would be the best one. Can anyone please shed some light on which houses are the best made and not so expensive. I'm looking for something in the $150-$250 price range.

Any and all suggestions are appreciated.

[Emil Pampell-Tx]

My strong recommendation is gourds. Martins prefer them throughout the south.

I would like to make one other recommendation: When you purchase a setup whether it be a house or gourds, the most important piece is the pole. Get a strong pole, one that will not blow down in a normal thunderstorm with 70 to 80 mph winds. Many new landlords go for the cheapest setup, and ignore the fact that it may blow down, and costing you more money in the long run

[msalcido]

Thanks. I've been thinking of gourds. I like the way they look; I see you have a ton of them . How easy are they to take care of? Also, do they come with Starling resistant openings?

As for the pole - any recommendations?

[GeneP]

I'm like Emil, I prefer gourds but others are just the opposite and some use both. Commercial gourds come with all kinds of entrances. You may want to browse the PMCA Shop for ideas - http://www.purplemartin.org/shop/ You can also use natural gourds if you like messing with things.

When it comes to poles most like something in the 2 to 3 inch outside diameter size for strength. I have a round pole 2 3/8 inch. I would rather have a square pole to make it easier to lower if storms are predicted. Square so that the gourds don't twist in the wind when lowered.

Your profile says that you didn't know you were supposed to do daily nest checks. You don't have to do daily checks but weekly are recommended.

[M.Stephens]

Have you been to Lost Creek in downtown Mineola?

[msalcido]

Thanks Gene - I'll check out the shop. I was just trying to figure out which were the best ones gourds, aluminum, wood, plastic, etc....I think the next one will be gourds since I already have the plastic heath one (not really pleased with it).

@M - I haven't been. I actually have a lake house in Golden on Lake Holbrook. Don't visit downtown too much. I'll look into it tomorrow.

[Scott D.- La]

I think you should take a look at the Safe Haven by Creative Universe Enterprises. I personally don't have one, but know everything made by this company is quality, at a fair price. Trio and Coates Watersedge can be made into decent housing with the right modifications. You did not specify material so I just assumed aluminum. Like the other's have stated, gourd racks are hard to beat however, much more expensive for a good set-up unless you make it yourself and grow natural gourds.

[John Miller]

I'd recommend the starter gourd rack from Creative Universe. We're using two of these at a public site I manage in Clarksville, Mo., and I've been pleased with them. These are strong and would fit your budget. Each holds 8 gourds, but we're using six each on two poles at this particular site,and hope to fill out the poles next year.

The only downside to these poles might be modest height 12 feet, but that's plenty high if your site is very open, and probably less prone to blowing over in a severe storm than some of the higher racks.

You could get a 14 foot rack that holds 12 gourds, and just use six for starters, having potential to expand.

My favorite gourd is the excluder because it's one piece and very solid and durable. One should vent it and put some texture in the bowl. The S&K gourds have these amenities, but have to be assembled.

Martins do like the Trio houses. On a budget, you can usually find one on sale on Craig's list or a yard sale, or an older one neglected in someone's yard and buy it for next to nothing, modify and upgrade it and have a fine house.

John Miller

[Mike E]

Thanks Gene - I'll check out the shop. I was just trying to figure out which were the best ones gourds, aluminum, wood, plastic, etc....I think the next one will be gourds since I already have the plastic heath one (not really pleased with it).

@M - I haven't been. I actually have a lake house in Golden on Lake Holbrook. Don't visit downtown too much. I'll look into it tomorrow.

I've got a S&K barn I have been using for several years now. Last year I put up 6 Bo-gourds below it. The small colony of nesters all but ignore the barn now and use the gourds. The singles still seem to use the barn sporadically. We had our first Mayfly hatch yesterday and the martins are piggin out!

[msalcido]

Thanks everyone. Some really good recommendations.

From all the threads I've been reading - It looks as if I need to invest in a really good pole system. My hunt begins!

[TGivens]

Mike E I have been looking at the Bo gourds for next season do they have the clean out ports in them

[KathyF]

With all due respect, if you're serious about investing in quality housing, do not even try the S&K barn with the Tri-tel pole. There have been so many of those poles that have bent over and crashed and killed martins, as well as caused injuries to landlords. Not to mention that the S&K houses require some serious modifications in order to enlarge the nesting compartments and make them owl proof.

Save your pennies and wait until the fall sales and pick up some quality equipment.

(**this note sent to you from a former S&K barn owner and mentor who finds these barns / poles bent / damaged all the time)

[richnet12]

My experience in SE Texas is that martins much prefer the houses over gourds. I offer both and they never look at the gourds. My mom has both and they ignore the gourds.
Definitely get a good pole system so that you can lower the house on a daily basis to check for sparrows and starlings and see the hatchlings grow up.

[Emil Pampell-Tx]

I am amazed that some people say that their martins ignore the gourds!

First off, I started with a house like most people do. I read about gourds after I found the PMCA. My SIL gave me a birdhouse gourd (so it was called but it didn't even have a neck!). I kept the seeds however, and planted them in the garden and got some decent gourds. I turned them into martin housing, and the martins immediately liked them. They had round holes however.

Since then, I have tried many different types of plastic gourds, and kept using many natural gourds. Had fairly good success with them. However, some of the plastic gourds remained empty. I didn't think that they liked plastic gourds. Since then, I have completely changed my mind. There no longer is a preference if you do the following:

Here is the secret to making martins like houses or gourds. USE A GOOD TUNNEL WITH PORCHES! I will say that a properly constructed tunnel with porches is the very best thing that will attract martins.

Many of the older plastic gourds have pitiful bad entrances and porches. I know that I will upset some people, but I would never use them as they come from the manufacturing companies. If you don't want to modify the older style gourds, then don't buy them. I like some of the newer type gourds and I have two that are made very good. There may be more but these two definitely are good: The Troyer vertical, and the BO11 and BO9 gourds. The martins like them, the tunnels (if you purchase them) are very good. These two types of gourds are very martin friendly for the following reasons:

1)Troyer vertical....its a well made single piece gourd that comes with a tunnel. Its ready to use as it comes, but I would suggest better ventilation, and better traction on the floor. The traction is not a big issue.

2)S&K BO11 and BO9- They both are excellent gourds if you purchase the Ultimate tunnel. They come in 3 or 4 pieces, and need to be assemblied. They are ready to use as they come, and don't need any modifications. They both have excellent ventilation, but you need to purchase the vent cap.

Lastly, if I had a house, I would tunnels and porches on it.

About the houses, I had a wooden T-14 style house, it never filled up, it did attract tons of starlings and sparrows, these pests chased away most of the martins that wanted to use the house. Even with trapping and shooting, the S&S kept coming. I fnally gave up, and gave the house away. That dropped the S&S problem a whole lot, and I then could control them.

[tonyg]

I agree with Emil... I have 34 gourds (super gourds, bo 9's and bo 11's with tunnels) and 5 modified trio's..the gourds fill up first, no doubt about it..

[Virgil McCoy]

Gourds are the way to go ! I've had traditional housing in the past but totally sold on gourds now. Traditional housing usually will not fill up and I think that is primarily due to lack of petitions between holes creating more fights among homesteading birds guarding a potential nest. Gourds can also be modified much easier because they are a single unit as opposed to a 12 room house. In addition, if a storm knocks down your housing a pvc gourd will survive the ground impact much better than a wood or aluminum house allowing it to be placed back into quick service.

[M.Stephens]

I've had a deluxe 12 gourd rack up for 3 years now and no martins in it . It has conley 2 entrances on supergourds and never had a nesting pair yet and is in a well open area. On some of my other housing with TVG's I finally got one pair under my T-14 And one pair under my Lonestar alamo. The T-14 never a nesting pair in it but the alamo had 5 nesting pair in the house this year.

[msalcido]

Interesting information. I wonder what attracts the martins to a paticular type of house/gourd? Does anyone know? Also, I wonder if geographical location plays a part on which they prefer gourds vs. houses?

I'm going to keep my house up but I think I'm leaning towards the gourds for the second one. So my next question is what is the purpose of tunnels? I can understand the porch but what am I missing on the tunnels? Also, is a 2' or 3' pole best to use? Those babies are expensive!

[Emil Pampell-Tx]

The value or the purpose of a tunnel, we just don't know the exact reason why martins like tunnels. some thoughts are:

1)provides better owl protection, and thus it makes the martins feel safer, and less likely to flush if an owl visits. It could change a 9in gourd (front to back) to a 12in or 14in distance, depending upon the length of the tunnel

2)could it be that the female can sit in that tunnel and keep all intruders out

3)do strange birds, like starlings, get a trapped feeling inside the tunnels, so they bother the martins less? Sure don't know if this is true.

4)a narrow tunnel could stop wing entrapment

Just some ideas, but really don't have definite reasons. The only thing that I know is that martins like to use them. Does this go back 100s of years to bank swallows, where they dug long narrow holes into the river banks...don't know!

[John Miller]

Mike

Two or three inch is used based on how heavy the housing (including gourds) and how high.

Higher really adds torch (not sure that's the right word)...leverage...fast. I don't know the physics of it, but somewhere I read that a 10 foot pole of the same size was three times as strong as a 15 footer. Not sure that's exact, but probably close.

That why I vaguely said earlier that a 12 foot pole with 8 gourds might be as strong as a higher pole, say 16 feet, with 24 gourds, and this season I have read on this and other forums about two instances of very strong storms bringing down these three inch, 16 foot poles. But they may have been hit by tornadoes, or certainly very strong storms.

two inch, 14 foot, probably is adequate for up 12 gourds; some systems put more gourds on these poles, but I'd suggest that if you go more than 12, then begin to consider 3 inch square, and you also may then want a winch system rather than a rope and pulley.

John M