I pulled out a starling nest with eggs from one of my enlarged Trio compartments at my public site this morning. There is no added traction on the porches. Needless to say I am concerned that scumbeaks have managed to get in. I have Trio SREH doors on all the houses. I also have 10 pairs of adult birds at the site currently.
Anyone encounter this with a Trio and have any modification ideas?
Starling breach in Trio Housing
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Mary Dawnsong
- Posts: 1685
- Joined: Wed Nov 12, 2003 8:17 pm
- Location: Michigan, Livingston County
Hi John,
That is very unfortunate.
Trio make two kinds of SREH doors - crescent and excluder.
http://purplemartin.org/shop/index.php? ... 0e0b9c3ead
I know a landlord who had starling problems with round hole Trios and switched to the Trio excluder doors, which have worked very well for her.
Good luck, Mary
That is very unfortunate.
Trio make two kinds of SREH doors - crescent and excluder.
http://purplemartin.org/shop/index.php? ... 0e0b9c3ead
I know a landlord who had starling problems with round hole Trios and switched to the Trio excluder doors, which have worked very well for her.
Good luck, Mary
Click here to see my colony
"In Michigan every martin matters"
"In Michigan every martin matters"
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John Miller
- Posts: 4866
- Joined: Mon Mar 22, 2004 9:11 pm
- Location: St. Louis, MO
I've heard of it. These openings are nearly one-half inch off the floor, which gives the starling more leverage. With the door swinging out and being secured by a floor clip, it's hard to put a block to raise the floor level. I've considered attaching a plastic gourd porch below the opening, secured to the door and cutting out a notch for the clip. It would raise the outside floor level..but it's just an idea that might spur other thoughts on it. John Miller
Hello John, John Miller gave you very good advice. I started my colony with a Duracraft DR-12 Martin house which is similar to the Trio in design, the doors and layout are identical.I modified the house with subfloors dividers and crescents, after several months and no problems with starlings i noticed 2 breaches. I could not tell if the starlings were smaller than normal, but this is a known issue with trio houses. Elevating the floor using a fairly slick plastic PVC type material to almost flush with the Crescent opening will resolve this. Cutting a notch to fit the clip will allow the doors to open with ease by simply using a stick to push the clip. This is my method after a whole season post modification the breaches by starlings stopped.
"We can judge the heart of man by his treatment of animals." - Immanual Kant.
https://plus.google.com/u/0/+JulioPrado954/posts
https://plus.google.com/u/0/+JulioPrado954/posts
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TrkrBob1949
- Posts: 100
- Joined: Wed May 17, 2006 7:20 pm
- Location: Louisiana/Belle Bower
Hi, John,
Starlings breached the Trio crescented doors on a couple of modified M-12s last year. I eventually killed both of them with my pellet rifle. Afraid that this might be the beginning of a trend, I started looking for an easy solution to my problem.
Since the homemade crescents on my homemade aluminum houses are flush with the floor, I have never had a starling breach them. So I figured the problem with the Trio doors is that at 1/2'' from the floor, the bottom of the crescent is too high. As John Miller stated in his post, the nature of the Trio door requires that the opening be this high for the door to engage the door clip. The addition of a 1/2" thick piece of wood in front of the door to bring the height of the floor up to flush is prevented because the compartment door must pivot up and down to open and close. There is an easy solution, though.
What I did was remove the door clip from the compartment door with the crescent entrance. This is easily done by drilling out the blind rivet that secures the clip to the compartment floor. Then I permanently secure the compartment door shut by pop riveting it to the compartment dividers/walls. If you don't have a rivet gun you can secure the doors shut with 6-32 machine screws and nuts. The shortest screws I have been able to find are 3/8" long. You can buy them by the box--screws and nuts combined--at Lowe's or Home Depot, or any hardware store.
Another method I just thought of while previewing this post is that you can use the aluminum rods that secure the compartment doors and center wall instead of screws and rivets. Just run the rods thru the bottom of the doors like they are installed at the top. I doubt if the crescented doors have the holes at the bottom of the doors predrilled, so you may have to do that yourself. This is probably the easiest way to permanently install the crescents, although the martins tangling their feet between the door and rod might be a problem. Since I have never done this, your house can be the test bed, okay?
Okay, moving right along. With the door clip removed and the crescented compartment door permanently secured, now you can add a small block of wood in front of the crescent to bring the floor up to flush with the bottom of the crescent entrance. You can vary the thickness of the wood that you use on the availability of the wood you have handy. As long as you get the wood within 1/4" of the crescent bottom you should be okay. If you have a table or band saw you can use 3/4" cedar and shave the extra quarter inch off of it to make it fit flush. Whichever is easiest for you.
You can secure the wood block to the floor by drilling screws into it from the bottom of the floor;just be sure you don't drive the screws all the way thru the board or it will impale the feet of the martins. Or you can counter-bore you wood piece and screw the machine screws in from the top of the wooden piece into the birdhouse floor, attaching the nuts from the bottom of the floor. I've confused you, haven't I? Well, just play with the wooden pieces for a while and I think you'll finally understand the steps I am trying to convey here.
With the compartment entrance permanently secured, you will now access the nesting compartment thru the opposite, or back door. The martins' nests are going to be at the back of the compartment, anyway, so entering from the back is no big deal. The only disadvantage to having your doors installed in this manner is that you can no long use the spare-o-door 'cause you can't remove the crescented door to install it.
I have another method that I sometimes use but you need a sheetmetal brake to make the modifications so I'm not even going to try and explain it here.
Do you have porch dividers on your houses? If you don't, I highly recommend them. Trio makes them for their houses and you may be able to get them thru the PMCA. I use both factory and homemade on all my modified Trio housing.
This should help you with your starling problem. Crossing my fingers, no starlings have breached the crescents in any of the houses this year and that has certainly been a relief.
Hope I have been able to help you.
Sincerely, Bob Bozeman
Starlings breached the Trio crescented doors on a couple of modified M-12s last year. I eventually killed both of them with my pellet rifle. Afraid that this might be the beginning of a trend, I started looking for an easy solution to my problem.
Since the homemade crescents on my homemade aluminum houses are flush with the floor, I have never had a starling breach them. So I figured the problem with the Trio doors is that at 1/2'' from the floor, the bottom of the crescent is too high. As John Miller stated in his post, the nature of the Trio door requires that the opening be this high for the door to engage the door clip. The addition of a 1/2" thick piece of wood in front of the door to bring the height of the floor up to flush is prevented because the compartment door must pivot up and down to open and close. There is an easy solution, though.
What I did was remove the door clip from the compartment door with the crescent entrance. This is easily done by drilling out the blind rivet that secures the clip to the compartment floor. Then I permanently secure the compartment door shut by pop riveting it to the compartment dividers/walls. If you don't have a rivet gun you can secure the doors shut with 6-32 machine screws and nuts. The shortest screws I have been able to find are 3/8" long. You can buy them by the box--screws and nuts combined--at Lowe's or Home Depot, or any hardware store.
Another method I just thought of while previewing this post is that you can use the aluminum rods that secure the compartment doors and center wall instead of screws and rivets. Just run the rods thru the bottom of the doors like they are installed at the top. I doubt if the crescented doors have the holes at the bottom of the doors predrilled, so you may have to do that yourself. This is probably the easiest way to permanently install the crescents, although the martins tangling their feet between the door and rod might be a problem. Since I have never done this, your house can be the test bed, okay?
Okay, moving right along. With the door clip removed and the crescented compartment door permanently secured, now you can add a small block of wood in front of the crescent to bring the floor up to flush with the bottom of the crescent entrance. You can vary the thickness of the wood that you use on the availability of the wood you have handy. As long as you get the wood within 1/4" of the crescent bottom you should be okay. If you have a table or band saw you can use 3/4" cedar and shave the extra quarter inch off of it to make it fit flush. Whichever is easiest for you.
You can secure the wood block to the floor by drilling screws into it from the bottom of the floor;just be sure you don't drive the screws all the way thru the board or it will impale the feet of the martins. Or you can counter-bore you wood piece and screw the machine screws in from the top of the wooden piece into the birdhouse floor, attaching the nuts from the bottom of the floor. I've confused you, haven't I? Well, just play with the wooden pieces for a while and I think you'll finally understand the steps I am trying to convey here.
With the compartment entrance permanently secured, you will now access the nesting compartment thru the opposite, or back door. The martins' nests are going to be at the back of the compartment, anyway, so entering from the back is no big deal. The only disadvantage to having your doors installed in this manner is that you can no long use the spare-o-door 'cause you can't remove the crescented door to install it.
I have another method that I sometimes use but you need a sheetmetal brake to make the modifications so I'm not even going to try and explain it here.
Do you have porch dividers on your houses? If you don't, I highly recommend them. Trio makes them for their houses and you may be able to get them thru the PMCA. I use both factory and homemade on all my modified Trio housing.
This should help you with your starling problem. Crossing my fingers, no starlings have breached the crescents in any of the houses this year and that has certainly been a relief.
Hope I have been able to help you.
Sincerely, Bob Bozeman
Be kinder than necessary because everyone you meet is fighting some kind of battle.
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TrkrBob1949
- Posts: 100
- Joined: Wed May 17, 2006 7:20 pm
- Location: Louisiana/Belle Bower
John,
When I finished my post I saw Julio's suggestion and re-read John Miller's. I dunno, my suggestion looks pretty complicated in comparison to theirs'. I think you should ignore mine.
Sincerely, Bob Bozeman
When I finished my post I saw Julio's suggestion and re-read John Miller's. I dunno, my suggestion looks pretty complicated in comparison to theirs'. I think you should ignore mine.
Sincerely, Bob Bozeman
Be kinder than necessary because everyone you meet is fighting some kind of battle.
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Guest
Thanks everyone for the replies. I am going to order some excluder doors for the houses. In the mean time I'm going to try some of your ideas. Don't know why I didn't check to see if Trio made these in the first place!
Anyway I'm releived to hear that others have heard or witnessed this with Trio houses.
Do you guys think pop riveting supergourd metal porches to the outside of the entance would work? I would bend them with pliers to make it flush or close to flush with the entrance.
Anyway I'm releived to hear that others have heard or witnessed this with Trio houses.
Do you guys think pop riveting supergourd metal porches to the outside of the entance would work? I would bend them with pliers to make it flush or close to flush with the entrance.
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John Miller
- Posts: 4866
- Joined: Mon Mar 22, 2004 9:11 pm
- Location: St. Louis, MO
I think the aluminum porches would work -- try one first. I'm holding one now -looks like you'd need to split it and turn each side upside down so the notch would go over the clip. Make sure there are no gaps to catch toenails, or sharp edges.
I'll add that many people use these Trio doors with only an occasional or no starling breach..so if it was a one time instance you'll need to decide whether modifying all doors is worth it. I think sometimes many houses with a particular SREH go for years with no problems, then one starling learns to enter and others follow.
John
I'll add that many people use these Trio doors with only an occasional or no starling breach..so if it was a one time instance you'll need to decide whether modifying all doors is worth it. I think sometimes many houses with a particular SREH go for years with no problems, then one starling learns to enter and others follow.
John
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Carlton
- Posts: 1959
- Joined: Tue May 17, 2005 6:42 pm
- Location: Florida/Deerfield Beach
- Martin Colony History: I moved to South Florida, from Delaware, in August of 2015.
I care for a 6 condo Sunset House as well as two Deluxe Gourd Racks, with 24 Chirpynest/Excluder gourds, along a canal in Pompano Beach, Florida.
At Quiet Waters Park, nearby in Deerfield Beach, I care for a Deluxe Gourd Rack with 12 TVG's. I also care for a Deluxe Gourd rack with 12 Excluder gourds with Modified Excluder entrances. I am substituting 6 Chirpynest boxes for 6 of the Conley II entranced gourds in 2026.
At another local park, Tradewinds Park in Coconut Creek, I care for a Trendsetter 12, 5 gourds rack with 60 Excluder gourds with Modified Excluder Entrances and 1 Deluxe Gourd Rack with 12 Troyer Vertical Gourds with Starling Stoppers over the Conley II's to keep out smaller starlings.
I am really surprised to read of these breaches in the Trio crescents as I have the MSS-8 and MSS-12, both modified, and lots of starlings around. I have never seen any indication that one got in. I hope it stays that way!
Personally, if I was having a problem I would purchase the Excluder plates for all the entrances and just put them on in place of the crescents. I have a mix of both, with the majority of them still crescents, and the martins enter and exit all compartments with no problems. I have nests in almost all compartments now irregardless of whether it has a crescent or an excluder entrance.
Personally, if I was having a problem I would purchase the Excluder plates for all the entrances and just put them on in place of the crescents. I have a mix of both, with the majority of them still crescents, and the martins enter and exit all compartments with no problems. I have nests in almost all compartments now irregardless of whether it has a crescent or an excluder entrance.
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Guest
If you are not using the excluder doors, order them now. I haven't had a problem with the excluders (so far).
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Guest
John I've never had a breach at this site or at my home site with crescents. I agree with you, if this was happening at my home, I would do nothing except wait for the starling to show up and plug him. The fact that this is at my public site, in a church parking lot no less, means I have to do something until the doors arrive.John Miller wrote:I think the aluminum porches would work -- try one first. I'm holding one now -looks like you'd need to split it and turn each side upside down so the notch would go over the clip. Make sure there are no gaps to catch toenails, or sharp edges.
I'll add that many people use these Trio doors with only an occasional or no starling breach..so if it was a one time instance you'll need to decide whether modifying all doors is worth it. I think sometimes many houses with a particular SREH go for years with no problems, then one starling learns to enter and others follow.
John