Bluebirds are fighting martins

[LCM]

Hello everyone, this is Linda from Many La.
I have interested martins for 4 days now. They want to land on houses really bad but won’t because the bluebirds are fighting them and it’s my fault, unfortunately.
I relocated the bluebird boxes within sight of where their previous boxes have been located for about 3 years.
I noticed the Martin population declining but didn’t know why until the light bulb came on a few months ago.
What, if anything can I do about this problem?
Problem being, I want the martins more than anything, but the bluebirds are fierce and standing their ground for the Martin boxes. Please help with tips, if there are any that anyone can shed light on. Thank you!
Sincerely,
LCM

[Phil01]

Have the bluebirds laid any eggs yet or are they just in the process of nest building? If they have laid eggs you can’t mess with them..
If they haven’t laid any eggs you can plug the housing and the blue birds should move over to your bluebird boxes. Doesn’t take long if they are in nest building mode… Watch them and see if they are bringing nesting material to the boxes… Once the bluebirds have taken to the boxes start opening up the Martin housing.
I did this several year back and within a week the bluebirds were using the box.. Now they live in harmony every season..
Good luck,
Phil

[LCM]

Mr Phil, good evening to you. No sir, just beginning to build nests. I just came from doing exactly what you recommended. The holes are stuffed with plastic bags with the handles sticking out. Thank you so much for taking your time to give this advice. God Bless you!
Sincerely,
Linda Moore from Many La.

[Phil01]

Thanks Linda, Good evening to you as well. Sounds great, let us know when the bluebirds take to the box and how it goes for you? Good luck this season, hope you fill up!
Phil

[LCM]

Yes sir Mr Phil, I sure will keep you posted. Thank you again.
Linda

[Martintown33]

Good luck Linda! I think it will work out..My bluebirds and martins get along with no issues, as others have said.. ..once your BBs move to the boxes, you shouldn’t have any problems..
Rob

[LCM]

Mr Rob, good evening. The blue birds continued to monitor the Martin boxes. Today I decided to take one of the bluebird boxes out of the nearby pasture beside the Martin boxes and I put this bluebird box at a distance safe enough from the Martin boxes and immediately this pair flocked to this house and began to build in it.
Now for my delima, the male scout and the other two with the scout have left and I am devastated.
They hung around for 5-6 days but continued to be fought by this pair of bluebirds.
I am praying that I will get other Martins or that by some miracle they will return. I really appreciate everyone giving tips and encouragement since I have become part of this forum. Sincerely, Linda Moore from Many La.

[Martintown33]

Hi Ms Linda. First, that’s great that your bluebirds have moved to the boxes. That was a good decision to do that. They prefer being lower to the ground and the smaller box cavities, than in Martin houses. They were probably protecting their boxes from the martins, thinking the martins might move in them. Moving it far away, removed that need to protect. As far as your purple martins, it’s not unusual to have a few martins (all males) disappear for a couple days. I’ve had this happen , when I was first starting up, years ago. I think they might be searching for females to bring back, but not sure. Hopefully they’ll be back soon! And new ones arrive too!
Let us know..
Good luck
Rob

[LCM]

Yes sir Mr. Rob, I do know you are right, it just encourages me to know that you are right about the fact that just because those 3 left, doesn’t mean other Martins won’t migrate through and when that happens, they won’t have the Bluebird problem.
Thank you for taking time to encourage and for your previous knowledge.
Sincerely, Linda Moore from Many, La.

[MJB]

Scouts left because blue birds attacked them. I have had Martins for 8 years. Last year bluebirds took over the whole house. I have cleaned out there nest and blocked the holes. Also put up new bluebird house.
I’m so sad not to have my Martins. Any suggestions? Thank you in advance.

[Jones4381]

Scouts left because blue birds attacked them. I have had Martins for 8 years. Last year bluebirds took over the whole house. I have cleaned out there nest and blocked the holes. Also put up new bluebird house.
I’m so sad not to have my Martins. Any suggestions? Thank you in advance.

Great advice in here and as I was starting out I wasn't diligent enough with the necessary upkeep to attract and keep Martins. Please do not take this as an attack as you may be doing everything you're suppose to but I was not. I watched my first year as a pair of Tree swallows made a nest, layed, and raised a brood...no martins in that house. In another BB's did the same thing. I joined this site and began to learn.

I began putting up housing for TS and BB's as well as mitigating HOSP's and have went to all SREH housing openings. Viewed yesterday all 8 Tree Swallow gourds were paired up with some others going to have to find a property somewhere else (pretty cools seeing 16+ TS's all flying around a few weeks here before the Martins arrive, it's the sign I usually know to be on the look out for the PM's). I have 4 wood boxes for the BB's and currently have 3 nest being built with either 2 or 3 pair (I just haven't monitored the BB's as closely since the Martins are stealing the show with their earlier than expected arrival this season.)

In the end I would suggest reading the materials on this site and reading the forum strings with listening to others experiences. I began by placing TS gourds 30 feet away from my PM poles (2 started with), the TS's immediately took to the low hanging gourds (6 feet from ground for me hanging from 10ft black pipe i cut to 8 and elbow 45 the 2 feet to hang to the pole after I drill hole for the wire.) For me the TS arrive about 2-3 weeks earlier than the Martins so I get all those single gourds ready in the fields (treat the same as martins with baffle guards and predator concerns). TS, BB's and PM's all coexist great together if managed but have different requirements and habits. These day's it's really not to much to manage b/c there is ample housing available for everyone... PS...Study BB's and TS habits as well. I find BB's will run each other off if there not separated by a minimum of 300 feet (best if line of site is interrupted for bluebirds as they are staunch defenders against their own kind). Tree Swallows I've found about 60 feet min with more if you have the room (mine are about 100-125 feet from each other, if you have ample housing as they can become territorial but not to the same level as BB's). TS prefer the gourds and BB's prefer the wood boxes around here i've learned as I've had neither nest in the other type so this has made it very easy (HOSP's go after the wood BB housing and have to be dealt with, zero issues with them on my gourd racks last year or this year so far (fingers crossed that continues). I'm all gourds with the PM's. Good luck.

[LCM]

Thank you so much for taking time to share past history, trial and error between all these birds. I totally understand all that you are explaining. It amazes me that you have all 3 species that are in close proximity but I’m sure it’s as you explained, each bird has different requirements they feel best meets their needs. I will have to step off the feet between the blue bird house within each of the boxes that house bluebirds.
I have an update though for all you thoughtful PM landlords.
Lo and behold I looked out the window this morning because of singing and there the PM’s were.
I lowered one of the pm houses and sure enough, I cleaned out 3 nests (no eggs thankfully).
I decided to look up song magnet out of curiosity that Ms Cheryl talked about and I decided to play the PM song and would you believe here comes those what I feel are the same 3 that came March 6. What that tells me is that the Martins have hung around since March 6 and really want my houses. It really appears that there is only one pair that isn’t giving up too easily. Back to stuffing the house again. My son purchased me a Trendsetter the beginning of March. I’ve never had anything that nice and was so elated and thankful for his generosity. The PM’s always try to land on the Royal Wing house. The bluebirds too only built in the Royal Wing, they never attempted to build in the Trendsetter. These boxes are side by side and that’s all I have.
Thank each and everyone that has taken their time to help me make sense of all my mistakes and encouraged me every step of the way with advice. God Bless you each one.
Sincerely, Linda Moore from Many, La. (Toledo Bend Country)

[flyin-lowe]

Now that I realized you had this thread going from the other one I responded in. As I mentioned earlier (for those that didn't see the other thread) it would be extremely rare for a blue bird to run off martins at an existing colony. I would check for other issues if your martins are leaving. Also, I know it sounds dumb, but you might post a picture of the blue birds you are seeing. It is not like blue birds to take over an entire martin house. I am not sure if you meant more than one pair are moving in, or if 1 blue birds was taking over an entire house. Either way, it doesn't seem normal.

[LCM]

Good morning, I am sorry to confuse. I am learning about how the forum works and where appropriate posts are placed.
Gosh I do seem to have more than one pair that wants the Martin boxes. The only thing that I can figure is that I have raised so many bluebirds that there may be more bluebird boxes required than what I have up for them currently.
Not to forget is that I have placed bluebird boxes too close in proximity to the Martin boxes and even though I relocated these bluebird boxes right close where you can see in a neighboring pasture, the bluebirds wants the Martin boxes.
All of these mistakes were done out of ignorance, just didn’t realize what I was doing to create this monster.
I even have a box called The Peep show with a blink camera inside. The hole has been constructed for small birds only ( for nuthatches) and the bluebirds are insistent on getting in but not possible.
These are definitely bluebirds with fluorescent blue on both male and female and bronze fluorescent on the males chest.
I have continued to stuff holes not allowing entrance.
I also am hoping that a larger influx of PM’s will come on creating a larger number to offset bluebirds.
Reason I said that is because every few days I see these 3 and I think they are scouts.
You have encouraged me with your statement in the beginning of your post regarding the established previous Martins not giving up.
Thank you flyinlowe for your insights. God Bless You
Linda Moore from Many La

[MJB]

Thank you for the comments. As I said before I have had Martins for at least 8 years. But last year the blue birds did take over one house. And tried to take over the other. They started out fine together. I found a lot of evidence in the houses when I cleaned them out. Eggs didn’t hatch and one dead Martin.
So this year when I put up house BBs came and I saw the scouts come to the house. The BBs attacked they had already started their nest in the very top of the house. So I gave it some time but no Martins. I cleaned out the house and stuffed the top holes. Put up new housing for BBs nearby also. I did see a few Martins check the houses. But as of today I have no BB in the houses but I also have No Martins. I going to unplug the holes and see what happens. I will try to get a picture of the BB. Thanks again for suggestions.

Jenene
Birmingham Alabama

[LCM]

Good morning Ms. Jenene, same exact scenario playing out here. I put up more BB boxes, I relocate more BB boxes and this morning, I am going outside and filling holes on the Trendsetter. I have all holes filled on the royal wing house. This is the one BB want.
I may not get PM’s this year for first time ever, but the BB’s won’t be staying in there either. They have their houses.

Additionally, I had a Troyer house trap constructed last year, equipped with stove pipe (storage when captured). I am working on getting that up. One of the gentleman tipped me that my Martin population dwindling may be other culprits, well just let me put this out there, I have European Starlings. While I have never seen any interaction between the starlings doing anything to martins or other birds, after reading over an hour on the forum about these enemies, I am working overtime to get this high tech trap up and doing what it’s supposed to do. The man that constructed it said he spent countless hours making sure this spring loaded mechanism works when the starlings go inside that opening. If yall know anything about Linda Moore, it is that I take you all around the world to make a point and chase many rabbits while getting there. Sorry.
I would have to go back to see who cut the light on for me, but I figure sure the starling has something to do for the dwindling PM population and I am so sad.
I can only go from here and move forward.
Thank you Ms Jenene for your experience and knowledge you have posted for me.
God Bless you!
Sincerely,
Linda Moore Many, La.

[Thomas Maddox]

Linda, I enjoy your posts! Keep fighting and learning. Are you monitoring for hawks, owls, raccoons, and especially rat snakes?

[MJB]

Thank you Linda I enjoyed the post too.
I have some good news today. We took out the plugs I had in the houses yesterday. This may sound silly but I used BLUE noodles to plug holes. I’m kinda wondering if the Martins thought they were BBs. Lol
Because today the Martins are exploring the houses !!!
I’m so excited ! Also to attract the PMs I play a video of them singing. So far we’ve seen 4 !
Good luck to you stay strong!

[LCM]

Good afternoon. Mr Thomas, yes, I try to be very alert and diligent when it comes to my Martin babies. I have found the best ever Snake proof method for bird boxes. I have those predator guards that are stovepipes so far up off the ground and they are attached to Tposts on the bluebird boxes. Additionally, I am known in my family for “THE WELCOME NET”, not kidding, lol
Ok so here is what this is, it’s bird netting that is used to protect fruit trees from animals birds varmints etc.
Let me tell you something, it’s foolproof. All you do is drape this netting around the base of whatever bird boxes you’re protecting. Hear me out, snakes are not going to escape this netting. I can’t tell you how many I’ve caught, all of them are chicken snakes. I am not allowing a snake to eat my bird eggs baby birds OR my chicken eggs.
The only thing that I ever let go was a king snake. King snakes kill other snakes. It was a challenge to cut it out of the netting. It had worked knots around the body because they go through very small squares in the netting trying to maneuver through. The harder they try, the tighter the netting gets around their body. You need to purchase the netting that has the smaller squares of plastic.
Far as coons possums etc, I have never ever had incident. Didn’t really realize they could be a threat. One evening not long ago, I failed to shut my chicken babies henhouse door in the early night at the close of the day. I stepped outside and I heard Bully Boy(rooster) he was in the yard and I knew he was supposed to be on the roost with his ladies. I walked inside the house and there stood a possum. First time that has ever happened. I just run him out and that was the end of it.
Thank you for pointing out those different threats Mr Thomas.
Ms Jenene, I am super excited about your 4 Martins!!! I know exactly how you feel. It’s wonderful.
I’m so thankful I have this forum to visit and post my woes. I have totally wore my husband down enlisting him for various things regarding my PM’s, not only that but just talking about all this that is discussed on the forum. Randy loves PM’s too but he’s not obsessed like I am, lol.
Sincerely,
Linda Moore from Many, La.

[Thomas Maddox]

Mrs. Linda, I definitely have the netting! I use both the bird and deer netting(for larger snakes). I like how you care for your babies!