Hey Everybody, Im a fairly new to this stuff. I need some help or I think my PM's are going to die from the starlings...
First, this winter I modified my Grandpa mss12 so that the outside 8 holes became 4 holes and are 6x12, leaving the 4 middle compartments 6x6. I did this by drilling 2 inch holes through the back walls as shown on some website and plugging up the hole on one side.
So my question is this, if I have not removed the walls and just have the holes connecting two compartments, will the starlings still not use it because its still in essence a 6x6 joined with a 6x6 with a regular size hole or am I in deep trouble... I saw a couple starlings flying around the house today and it freaked me out!!!!!! HELP!!!!
Thanks So MUCH!!!
DPW
Newbie with a questions!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Emil Pampell-Tx
- Posts: 6743
- Joined: Tue Nov 11, 2003 1:26 pm
- Location: Tx, Richmond (SW of Houston)
- Martin Colony History: First started in Gretna, La in 1969 with a small homemade house, have had martins ever since at 2 different homes in Texas
A very definite yes! In fact, the starlings are more likely to use the 6x12 than a 6x6. The starlings simply love the large compartments. I would recommend a bit larger hole between the two old compartments, like maybe a 3in hole, but the 2in may work fine for you..
I have some questions for you also, my 1st is: have you tried or used the starling resistant entry holes (SREH is the abbreviation)? These are very good at keeping out the starlings...there are many types and most of them work very good..some SREH that are in use, they are all slightly different are the 1) Crescent 2) WDC 3) excluder 4) modified excluder, etc.. all of these will keep out 90% or so of the starlings..If you put them on your housing, it may practically eliminate the starling problem, especially if you try to trap the starlings with a big round holed trap...
Tell us some more, I live SW of Houston so maybe we could talk to each other, what type of holes are you using, did you have martins last year?
I have some questions for you also, my 1st is: have you tried or used the starling resistant entry holes (SREH is the abbreviation)? These are very good at keeping out the starlings...there are many types and most of them work very good..some SREH that are in use, they are all slightly different are the 1) Crescent 2) WDC 3) excluder 4) modified excluder, etc.. all of these will keep out 90% or so of the starlings..If you put them on your housing, it may practically eliminate the starling problem, especially if you try to trap the starlings with a big round holed trap...
Tell us some more, I live SW of Houston so maybe we could talk to each other, what type of holes are you using, did you have martins last year?
PMCA Member, 250 gourds, 6 poles, 2traps
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Guest
I have looked into getting some SREH doors for the house but last year when I never had a problem with the regular 6x6 but I guess now I need to upgrade a little. I live in Houston, Texas inside the loop.
I dont have an ideal location with trees in a couple directions only 20ft away but the Martins around here that Ive observed at other peoples houses are not as picky as some and will use houses with trees less than 5ft away and powerlines above as I have seen.
I had one or two pairs last year, the first year I put up my house, so that pleased me a lot, but the DAMN house sparrows got the eggs I think because one day when I lowered it to check the nest and make sure no sparrows were building I noticed the eggs were broken so that was dissappointing. Hopefully it will work out better this year.
I dont have an ideal location with trees in a couple directions only 20ft away but the Martins around here that Ive observed at other peoples houses are not as picky as some and will use houses with trees less than 5ft away and powerlines above as I have seen.
I had one or two pairs last year, the first year I put up my house, so that pleased me a lot, but the DAMN house sparrows got the eggs I think because one day when I lowered it to check the nest and make sure no sparrows were building I noticed the eggs were broken so that was dissappointing. Hopefully it will work out better this year.
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Emil Pampell-Tx
- Posts: 6743
- Joined: Tue Nov 11, 2003 1:26 pm
- Location: Tx, Richmond (SW of Houston)
- Martin Colony History: First started in Gretna, La in 1969 with a small homemade house, have had martins ever since at 2 different homes in Texas
The sparrows probably did break the eggs..when I first moved here, there was a house with a beautiful horse barn across the street from me, the sparrows were so loud, there must have been a hundred there. I started trapping them, as did 2 neighbors about 4 houses down the street, and between the 3 of us, we must have trapped a couple hundred sparrows the first year, about 100 the second, and now we are down to about 15 per year...we really thinned them out. I personally only saw 2 sparrows this year..I trap them all year long, but I am retired so I can monitor the traps..
on the large compartments, I would definitely recommend that you put some SREH on them if you get some martins..I would also recommend that you try to trap the starlings and sparrows..they destroy so many of the nests, eggs, and birds of our native American species, all that I had when we moved here was sparrows. Now we have cardinals, bluebirds, chickadees, finchs, mockingbirds, doves, several kinds of woodpeckers, etc altogether about 12 to15 varieties of native American birds...it really does help to trap the non-natives.
on the large compartments, I would definitely recommend that you put some SREH on them if you get some martins..I would also recommend that you try to trap the starlings and sparrows..they destroy so many of the nests, eggs, and birds of our native American species, all that I had when we moved here was sparrows. Now we have cardinals, bluebirds, chickadees, finchs, mockingbirds, doves, several kinds of woodpeckers, etc altogether about 12 to15 varieties of native American birds...it really does help to trap the non-natives.
PMCA Member, 250 gourds, 6 poles, 2traps
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John Miller
- Posts: 4866
- Joined: Mon Mar 22, 2004 9:11 pm
- Location: St. Louis, MO
If I understand this, it's exactly what I hoped two years ago at a new site -- that starlings may not nest in the back or side 6 x 6 nest chamber, and thus you might not need SREH. Unfortunately, starlings love these back 6 x 6 rooms because they are now darker and more secluded. It's probably the light that gets into the standard 6 x 6 that deters them.
I'll also offer a warning about "male house sparrow revenge" syndrome. If you pull out nests and don't trap the male sparrow, he gets meaner as the season progresses and will set about breaking martin eggs and tossing out very young martins. (Unmated sparrows may do this anyway. )If you can't trap, be careful about nest removal, especially when the martins have active nests. If I could not trap/shot, I'd maybe just adle (shake hard) the sparrow eggs to buy some time.
John Miller
I'll also offer a warning about "male house sparrow revenge" syndrome. If you pull out nests and don't trap the male sparrow, he gets meaner as the season progresses and will set about breaking martin eggs and tossing out very young martins. (Unmated sparrows may do this anyway. )If you can't trap, be careful about nest removal, especially when the martins have active nests. If I could not trap/shot, I'd maybe just adle (shake hard) the sparrow eggs to buy some time.
John Miller
Last edited by John Miller on Thu Mar 02, 2006 8:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
I've had a S&S trap up for the last week and had my 1st Bud come to the gourds yesterday. Everyday I am averaging 1-3 Starlings or sparrows.
Both are destructive to everyone's PM's.
I built the trap myself and am amazed @ how the thing performs.
I highly recommend this trap if you are present to release PM's trapped or any desireable bird.
Both are destructive to everyone's PM's.
I built the trap myself and am amazed @ how the thing performs.
I highly recommend this trap if you are present to release PM's trapped or any desireable bird.
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Guest
You are exactly right John, I did the same as you did. Infact after reading these replies (thanks to all) I just purchased 6 excluder doors for the 4 compartments which are 6x12 now so I should be set. Im actually a very good marksman and have shot 3 sparrows and a starling over the last couple days even though my mother yells at me lol!!John Miller wrote:If I understand this, it's exactly what I hoped two years ago at a new site -- that starlings may not nest in the back or side 6 x 6 nest chamber, and thus you might not need SREH. Unfortunately, starlings love these back 6 x 6 rooms because they are now darker and more secluded. It's probably the light that gets into the standard 6 x 6 that deters them.
I'll also offer a warning about "male house sparrow revenge" syndrome. If you pull out nests and don't trap the male sparrow, he gets meaner as the season progresses and will set about breaking martin eggs and tossing out very young martins. (Unmated sparrows may do this anyway. )If you can't trap, be careful about nest removal, especially when the martins have active nests. If I could not trap/shot, I'd maybe just adle (shake hard) the sparrow eggs to buy some time.
John Miller
(Im just a highschool student who has been addicted to martins since I was 4 yrs old and my grandparents had an old wooden house with a couple martins in Tupelo, Missisippi that I would watch all day when I was a little kid, since then Ive learned to hate starlings and sparrows and do whatever I can to stop them from hurting my favorite birds, sorry guys, woodpeckers but I still love my martins!!!)
I will consider investing in one of those traps that inserts into the house later when I make some money (poor HS student) lol. Thanks everyone!
Last edited by Guest on Thu Mar 02, 2006 9:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Before I installed excluders, starlings killed an adult female martin in a 6x6 compartment with round holes. Whether they nest in the compartments or not, they'll at the very least displace the martins, and worst case scenario, destroy eggs, babies, and even adult martins. They can't be tolerated at all. I went to excluders because that was all I could find on short notice. The martins have never seemed to have a problem getting in and out.
Patrick
Patrick
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Emil Pampell-Tx
- Posts: 6743
- Joined: Tue Nov 11, 2003 1:26 pm
- Location: Tx, Richmond (SW of Houston)
- Martin Colony History: First started in Gretna, La in 1969 with a small homemade house, have had martins ever since at 2 different homes in Texas
Since you said that you are a high school student, I am especially happy that you got on line, it is refreshing to see that some of the young people like you become interested in this hobby. I also started when I was young, I became hooked, and had them ever since...
By the way, I make my own traps with a few boards and a stiff piece of wire (like a coathanger), and if you need photos, I will try to send them to you...
By the way, I make my own traps with a few boards and a stiff piece of wire (like a coathanger), and if you need photos, I will try to send them to you...
PMCA Member, 250 gourds, 6 poles, 2traps
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Guest
As cold hearted as it may sound the ones you shot will not be a problem again. The ones you trap will come back if you release them a distance away. My wife calls me a murderer 
when I shoot a sparrow but by taking that life I am saving many martin lives, and they are the ones that need the help. I fully expect to get slammed for these statements but I don't have any sparrow or starling problems, at all, and when they do light on my gourd rack I do what I have to do to keep my Martin housing free and safe for the Martins.
when I shoot a sparrow but by taking that life I am saving many martin lives, and they are the ones that need the help. I fully expect to get slammed for these statements but I don't have any sparrow or starling problems, at all, and when they do light on my gourd rack I do what I have to do to keep my Martin housing free and safe for the Martins.-
Guest
why would or should you be slammed for killing a killer. Its like executing a guy thats murdered 5 children and their parents... think about it sparrow killer haters...Sabaharr wrote:As cold hearted as it may sound the ones you shot will not be a problem again. The ones you trap will come back if you release them a distance away. My wife calls me a murderer
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Guest
DPW, I had a very similar situation as Patrick wrote to you.
Here is the background story:
About eight years ago, we put up a Trio house with 12 compartments, of 6 x 6 each, which I later learned was better to modify. However, that first season we attracted an SY couple who raised four babies -- how fun! Our introduction into the "world" of martins!
The second year we had the house modified to six compartments of 6x12 each. I was still using the round entrances, as we had seen no problems the first year with using them. At the beginning of that season, I noticed a couple of starlings on the top of the house, so I thought later that day that I would lower the house. What a sad sight -- there was a beautiful male ASY martin, killed by those starlings. He was inside the compartment. I was shaken -- and immediately ordered six SREH openings from the PMCA, and thankfully, they arrived very quickly.
I immediately put them on and have never again used round openings, wanting to protect the martins from that scenario ever happening again. I have read about people being hesitant because they feel that the martins are not sure about entering the different shaped openings, but martins are smart and will definitely figure it out, and it is THE right thing to do in order to protect them from starlings.
I trap the sparrows, but with the starling resistant openings, we've never again had problems with starlings. They just take a look and realize that our housing won't allow them, so they move on.
I hope this true-life history lesson will encourage you in your martin landlord efforts! Best of luck to you this season! -- RG
Here is the background story:
About eight years ago, we put up a Trio house with 12 compartments, of 6 x 6 each, which I later learned was better to modify. However, that first season we attracted an SY couple who raised four babies -- how fun! Our introduction into the "world" of martins!
The second year we had the house modified to six compartments of 6x12 each. I was still using the round entrances, as we had seen no problems the first year with using them. At the beginning of that season, I noticed a couple of starlings on the top of the house, so I thought later that day that I would lower the house. What a sad sight -- there was a beautiful male ASY martin, killed by those starlings. He was inside the compartment. I was shaken -- and immediately ordered six SREH openings from the PMCA, and thankfully, they arrived very quickly.
I immediately put them on and have never again used round openings, wanting to protect the martins from that scenario ever happening again. I have read about people being hesitant because they feel that the martins are not sure about entering the different shaped openings, but martins are smart and will definitely figure it out, and it is THE right thing to do in order to protect them from starlings.
I trap the sparrows, but with the starling resistant openings, we've never again had problems with starlings. They just take a look and realize that our housing won't allow them, so they move on.
I hope this true-life history lesson will encourage you in your martin landlord efforts! Best of luck to you this season! -- RG