The babies from 13 nests fledged between 2 and 3 weeks ago. A large number of them visited each evening for the first week. One night we had extra visitors and well over 100 PMs were flying around the house. We really enjoyed the sight. They stopped coming around about 1 week ago.
One SY pair started their nest later than the rest. They had 3 eggs with only one hatching. They are still feeding the baby, but only seem to come sporadically. The house appears to be abandoned throughout most of the day. I estimate that it will fledge about 3 weeks later than the rest. The baby appears to be healthy. Is this normal behavior?
Bob Burkard
Douglassville, PA
Is this normal?
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Steve Kroenke
- Posts: 4342
- Joined: Fri Nov 28, 2003 6:49 pm
- Location: Louisiana/Logansport
Hey Bob,
Yes, this behavior of some late nesting martins can be "normal". Here is a link to an article I posted about this subject. You may find it of interest.
http://forum.purplemartin.org/forum/vie ... cb8e365c91
Steve
Yes, this behavior of some late nesting martins can be "normal". Here is a link to an article I posted about this subject. You may find it of interest.
http://forum.purplemartin.org/forum/vie ... cb8e365c91
Steve
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Bob Burkard
- Posts: 57
- Joined: Thu Nov 13, 2003 7:56 pm
- Location: Oldsmar, FL
Steve,
Thank you for your response and for pointing me to your previous posting. Your posting is very informative and is exactly the behavior that I am observing.
Bob
Thank you for your response and for pointing me to your previous posting. Your posting is very informative and is exactly the behavior that I am observing.
Bob
Steve,
Has it ever happened, that you know of, that late nester Martins have abandoned their young completely? Someone told me that if the Martins realize they don't have enough time left to fledge their young they will feed them poisonous berry's!!!!! I do a lot of reading on this Forum, but I have never read anything like this. Your comments, Please.. Jim
Has it ever happened, that you know of, that late nester Martins have abandoned their young completely? Someone told me that if the Martins realize they don't have enough time left to fledge their young they will feed them poisonous berry's!!!!! I do a lot of reading on this Forum, but I have never read anything like this. Your comments, Please.. Jim
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Emil Pampell-Tx
- Posts: 6743
- Joined: Tue Nov 11, 2003 1:26 pm
- Location: Tx, Richmond (SW of Houston)
- Martin Colony History: First started in Gretna, La in 1969 with a small homemade house, have had martins ever since at 2 different homes in Texas
Xkper2000, I have been raising martins since the 1960s, and I have never seen or heard of that at my place. What does happen sometimes is this, there seem to be more runts late in the season, and if the runts don't fly or try to fly, the parents sometimes abandon them so that they can take care of the ones that do fly.
I had one late nest this year, the mother stayed with the babies until they fledged, and every morning, there seemed to be about 20 to 25 martins that came to check on her. She stayed about 2 weeks longer than any other martins. This late nest fledged 3 big healthy babies.
Also, SY martins often abandon their nests before the eggs are hatched, they lay fewer eggs usually, and they don't always take very good care of the babies. Maybe what you described is what I call normal behavior of SY birds.
I had one late nest this year, the mother stayed with the babies until they fledged, and every morning, there seemed to be about 20 to 25 martins that came to check on her. She stayed about 2 weeks longer than any other martins. This late nest fledged 3 big healthy babies.
Also, SY martins often abandon their nests before the eggs are hatched, they lay fewer eggs usually, and they don't always take very good care of the babies. Maybe what you described is what I call normal behavior of SY birds.
PMCA Member, 250 gourds, 6 poles, 2traps
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Laverne
- Posts: 2216
- Joined: Thu Jan 08, 2004 1:58 pm
- Location: TX/Alvin
- Martin Colony History: Erected 1st house in 1997. Birds were checking it out before Mike got down from the ladder. Six cavities had a little colony 1st year. Grown to 88 cavities all gourds with near 100% occupancy. Most important factor for success is rain = bugs.
Xkper2000,
I agree with Emil.
This season was unusual for us. We had a lot more Subadult (SY) pairs than we usually do. My last nest was two weeks later than normal. The parents were SYs. They had three young. One of them was a "runt". He did not survive. The other two were beautiful, healthy fledglings. Purple Martins do not knowingly feed their young anything that would harm them.
This is just another example of the old "wive's tales" that are embedded in the Purple Martin's past. You know... like they eat mosquitos...
I agree with Emil.
This season was unusual for us. We had a lot more Subadult (SY) pairs than we usually do. My last nest was two weeks later than normal. The parents were SYs. They had three young. One of them was a "runt". He did not survive. The other two were beautiful, healthy fledglings. Purple Martins do not knowingly feed their young anything that would harm them.
This is just another example of the old "wive's tales" that are embedded in the Purple Martin's past. You know... like they eat mosquitos...
Sincerely,
Laverne
Laverne
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Steve Kroenke
- Posts: 4342
- Joined: Fri Nov 28, 2003 6:49 pm
- Location: Louisiana/Logansport
Hey Jim,
I have not experienced total abandonment of young by late nesting martins. However, I have had some male martins, particularly SYs, abandon their families prior to fledging. Others just significantly reduced their parental care, but were there when the young fledged. In all these cases, the females continued to provide good parental care though some of these females did reduce their number of feedings and would sometimes leave in the afternoons and not return till later the following morning. I have had late nesting parent martins that were lost to Cooper?s hawks and barred owls and then the young died.
I have been told by some folks that they thought their late nesting parent martins had abandoned the young. In these cases, perhaps predators struck and killed the parents though the landlords did not see it happen. However, there could always be very rare cases where both male and female finally depart with the flock, thereby leaving their young behind. This might occur when the young are malnourished (runts) or possess some kind of congenital defect which prevents them from flying. Also, if the nest is overrun with parasites, then the parents might desert their young. And extreme drought conditions and prolong heat may significantly reduce the availability of flying insects late in the season. In these cases, the parents may be unable to find sufficient food and finally abandon the nest site. The parents perhaps recognize the futility of the situation and leave to migrate.
I don?t? believe martins would feed their young poisonous berries if the parents realized there was insufficient time to fledge them and I have never heard of such a thing. Since martins don?t feed on vegetable matter, they would not be seeking out berries in my opinion and certainly couldn?t differentiate poisonous from non-poisonous ones. However, parent martins may remove dying or dead recently hatched babies from the nest.
Steve
I have not experienced total abandonment of young by late nesting martins. However, I have had some male martins, particularly SYs, abandon their families prior to fledging. Others just significantly reduced their parental care, but were there when the young fledged. In all these cases, the females continued to provide good parental care though some of these females did reduce their number of feedings and would sometimes leave in the afternoons and not return till later the following morning. I have had late nesting parent martins that were lost to Cooper?s hawks and barred owls and then the young died.
I have been told by some folks that they thought their late nesting parent martins had abandoned the young. In these cases, perhaps predators struck and killed the parents though the landlords did not see it happen. However, there could always be very rare cases where both male and female finally depart with the flock, thereby leaving their young behind. This might occur when the young are malnourished (runts) or possess some kind of congenital defect which prevents them from flying. Also, if the nest is overrun with parasites, then the parents might desert their young. And extreme drought conditions and prolong heat may significantly reduce the availability of flying insects late in the season. In these cases, the parents may be unable to find sufficient food and finally abandon the nest site. The parents perhaps recognize the futility of the situation and leave to migrate.
I don?t? believe martins would feed their young poisonous berries if the parents realized there was insufficient time to fledge them and I have never heard of such a thing. Since martins don?t feed on vegetable matter, they would not be seeking out berries in my opinion and certainly couldn?t differentiate poisonous from non-poisonous ones. However, parent martins may remove dying or dead recently hatched babies from the nest.
Steve