Help ID'ing and lowering old house.

[flyin-lowe]

A friend of mine purchased a property and he called and stated it has a purple martin colony. From his description it sounds like an older trio house. He said it is green and white, 12 room rectangular shape, could be a Heath or some other brand. He said a couple of the doors are open slightly and he didn't know how to lower the house. I asked him about a pulley and he said there is a rope going up to the house however he said there are what he described as a couple of "clamps" built into sections of the pole. He said he loosened the rope but the house did not move at all and according to him even if it would have started to come down it would have hit a "clamp". I know the details are vague but I am not familiar with these older aluminum houses. Based on his basic description does this ring a bell with anyone. I figured the pole itself would lower similar to a S&K tri tell but if that was the case I didn't know the purpose of the rope. I think he said the pole was round but to be honest I don't remember if asked him that or not.

[AndyShutterbug]

Flyin-lowe,

If I were to guess, I'd say that your friend has a Heath hexagonal AH-12D. I got one of those from my wife for Christmas a few years ago. That's when I started getting into this. The pole which is commonly sold with that is a four section assembly of progressively smaller diameter pipe. The sections are held together by the wedging action of a strangely shaped lever. Its shape tends to hold it in the wedged position once it is pulled in tight. I'm sorry to say that I hate that pole. I moved on to a T14 house with a big solid pole and a winch system. I don't know what that rope might be, but the Heath is designed to be lowered by hand as you loosen each section and allow it to telescope down into a lower section. You always have to be careful to not rotate the house, as the birds know which direction their porch should face. I use my pole year round now to hold up some bird feeders and a hand made platform (for seed or eggshell) I adapted to the upper section. It's also where my songbird magnet is tweeting now. My pole, with very small weight up there, won't stay extended. Some of those clamps magically let loose on windy days. I find it down a section and wedged incredibly into the next pipe. Tell him to use with caution. Consider finding out if a different pole can be used. The house mounts to that small upper pipe section via a plastic flanged pipe fitting sorta thing. The flange is 4-5" where it mounts to the box, but it has a plastic pipe sleeve which snugly fits the narrow top pipe. Someone mechanically inclined could come up with a way to fit it to a larger pole. the center 5" diameter of the roof of the house is a separate little "hat". It stays on the pole. And the compartments don't go all the way to the pole. They stop in such a way that there is a dead space up through the center of the house. So the house could ride a pole instead of being just hard mounted to one.

One important point, the house should be modified to close off every other compartment from the outside. Then, this closed compartment should be opened via an internal wall to the compartment next to it. This gives the martins twice the space...a vestibule and a nesting room. This is vital to prevent hawk/owl predation.

Here are photos of the Heath system I think he has:
http://imgur.com/a/2Tsrw

Andy

[4th Gen Martin Fan]

flyin-lowe,
As pointed out by Andy, I hope that your friend's martin house is not a Heath house. I refuse to work on Heath houses. I modified one with a mentee and will never do it again.
Hopefully it is a Trio Grandpa or Nature House, Inc. MSS12. The Trio Jedi Council will be interested in case assistance can be provided.
A picture will be necessary to tell what your friend's martin house is.

[AndyShutterbug]

I just read your post again and you said "rectangular". I need to get new glasses or brush up on my geometry. I read 12-room green & white and just started to visualize my own first house. Hopefully you've got something better...for the house AND the pole. Sorry if I muddied the waters.

Andy

[4th Gen Martin Fan]

flyin-lowe,
I still wonder if your friend's martin house is a Trio Grandpa or Nature House, Inc. MSS12. Words like "rectangular, green and white, open doors, and rope are suspicious for Trio/Nature House brand.
I have seen some pretty ingenious and some very bad homemade pole systems that were made by owners to overcome damage to the original Trio pole. One involved clamps to hold the homemade pole system together. Unfortunately the clamps prevented the house from being lowered down to eye level.
As far as the original plastic pulley on a Trio rope/pulley system, they are notorious for deteriorating and breaking. A bad pulley can prevent the house from being raised and lowered.
I feel that Trio design houses are worth restoring, modifying and using. They can last for a long time if taken care of.
Are they a Trendsetter or Safe Haven? No. Are they still attractive to and used by purple martins? Yes.

[flyin-lowe]

He said it is definitely a standard rectangular shape and not the Heath that is pictured above. I need to drive down there and check it out.

[Matt F.]

What you're describing sounds like what Mark mentioned - either a TG-12 or MSS-12.
They are the same, except the MSS-12 has the corporate lawyer suggested lanyard lock.
Since your friend said it's not wanting to come down, even when loosening the rope/lanyard, it's most likely an MSS-12 since the lanyard locks can be cranky and keep the house from properly being lowered.
Here's a photo of what Mark and I think your friend has:
Photo credit: Nature House Inc.

[Henry Limpet]

Try this:

Gently pull straight down on the rope. While still holding rope down, sway it outward, away from the pole, on a 45 degree angle. (Similar to how you would lower mini blinds).

That action should release a sort of small rectangular metal locking bar (directly underneath the house) at which point you may do a slow and controlled lowering of the house. Don't let go of that rope or you will see lots of birds, ala Tom 'N Jerry.

That is how it is done on a Trio G'Pa, anyway.

Good Luck!

[4th Gen Martin Fan]

Matt,
I did not think about the lanyard lock. Great point. Hopefully that is the problem instead of a deteriorated plastic pulley.
It would be nice to rescue another Trio house.
The best example of Trio house rescues is Andrew (DornCounty).
How many Trio houses have you rescued so far?

[flyin-lowe]

I had him google the house image and he said that is it. Now for those of you who are familiar with them did they come with a pole that had some type of clamps built into it or has someone likely rigged the house onto some other type of pole? I might be down that way tomorrow to check it out in person. Ill let you know what I find.

[Henry Limpet]

Yes. There should one one, dual clamp. It connects at the top of the base pole and the bottom of the upper/main pole, securing the two together with bolts.

It should not interfere with the lowering of the house whatsoever. The clamp is apx. 4-5' off the ground.......or so.

[Matt F.]

The best example of Trio house rescues is Andrew (DornCounty).
How many Trio houses have you rescued so far?

Not near as many as Andrew, and some others.
I think 5 is the count.
Not very impressive.......

[4th Gen Martin Fan]

Matt,
Your knowledge base and enthusiasm for Trio houses far exceeds mine. Does anyone know as much about Trio history and models?
When I see an obscure Trio house, I think to myself, "What in the world is that Trio model?!" along with "Matt will know what that is and when it was made!!"
You have been an invaluable resource to the Forum and I appreciate it.

[Matt F.]

Thanks Mark!
You are too kind.
I really appreciate the kind words. It means a lot.

[flyin-lowe]

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He sent me a couple pics. Does this appear to be a pole that would have come with the house or something retrofitted. He said he pulled the rope out like a mini blind but it didn't unlatch anything. He said even if it would have he doesn't think the house could come down the pole. He said the latches on this pole would stop it. He said the latches clamp to two sections of the pole at the same time and even when he loosened it it still would not come down. Curious if this is the correct pole and it just needs lubrication etc. or if someone has just stuck this house on top of some pole.

[Kyler]

This might have been talked about but it appears to me that. That pole is supposed to be used for a model M12K. The M12K does not have a rope and pulley it sets on the top of the pole. So when you loosen those clamps the pole sections should come down. It could be just rust in the poles. But for the house that you have is for a pole that is three sections. Two connect so they are the same diameter so there wouldn't be anything that the house could be stopped on coming down. Then the bottom section is bigger. It has a clamp similar to the clamps on your pole but they have to be loosen by bolts and nuts. But it's only at the bottom so your bottom section can attach to the middle pole. Also so your rope can tie off at. But that is what it appears to me. But what I have learned is your house in the pictures is a MSS12W. The only thing different is the porch rails. The MSS12 only has one porch rail. They don't make the MSS12W models anymore. So its a great find. I have one of these houses. The martins seem like they like the taller rails. At least mine do I think anyways.

Kyler,

[Matt F.]

This might have been talked about but it appears to me that. That pole is supposed to be used for a model M12K.

You nailed it Kyler - good eye.
That is the Nature House MPQ model pole.

Flyin-Lowe,
Like Kyler alluded to, that house is designed to slide up and down the top two 1 1/4" sections of the Nature House SSP pole.
If your friend could find good strong high-schedule 1 1/4" conduit, he could conceivably make a new pole using approx. 10 feet of the conduit as the top section the house would slide up and down, and then repurposing the middle, 1 1/2" section of his existing MPQ pole as the new bottom section.
Just kind of thinking out loud.........

[Matt F.]

But what I have learned is your house in the pictures is a MSS12W. The only thing different is the porch rails. The MSS12 only has one porch rail. They don't make the MSS12W models anymore. So its a great find. I have one of these houses. The martins seem like they like the taller rails. At least mine do I think anyways.

So true Kyler - the old, triple spaghetti rail MSS-12 units are kind of becoming collector's pieces - at least to us Trio nerds.
The MSS-12W was actually the MSS-12 system, but packaged to included the winch and cable kit (the "W" being for winch).
Of course way back, the original was the TG-12 ("TG" standing for Trio Grandpa).
The only difference between the TG-12 and the more recent MSS-12, was the introduction of the lanyard lock device.
The newest single-rail "release" you mentioned, is the MSS-12R ("R" presumably standing for rail, as in a new single-rail system).

[flyin-lowe]

Thanks for all the info guys. He has several ASY martins and I am sure that some SY's are there too.

[Kyler]

Matt,
Alright thanks well I know. So I have a MSS12. But anyways I have one at my home colony. I'm planning on converting it to a winch and cable. As well as my Mini Castle. But yes they are very neat I have a friend that has 2 of them in his colony. I actually got this one from him. I also have two of them on a Mutipurpose pole at the Golf Course. But my question is can you use a different kind of winch on them other than the winch Trio Band makes?

Kyler,