No Martins After EIGHT Years - time to move housing, again?

[Daryl Lindstrom - MN]

I have been trying to attract martins to my home site since 2000. I still haven't had a single pair nest!!!

I have had the housing in three different locations over the years. Each time I moved the housing, I placed the housing further from many acres of dense woods. Now being the eighth year, I think I should move the houses again, once again further from the wooded area and closer to a field / swampy area.

I manage five different colonies within an 18 mile radius of my home site. Each colony consists of a T-14 w/4 Excluder Gourds and a Super System 24 Gourd Rack w/24 Excluder Gourds. I am considering installing the same housing at my home site. Perhaps young that fledge from my public sites would be more willing to colonize a new site if the housing is the exact same as they were raised in???

Please let me know what you think of the new location. The proposed location is shown in red. After eight years, that has to be something I can do?!?!

[Guest]

I would guess that they may have some preference for housing that they're used to, but they seem pickier in some areas of the country than others. If you look around at other colonies, do the successful ones (populated ones) have anything in common with respect to housing?

Another thought: is it possible that the PM housing site is just too far from humans (your house or another house)?
Best of luck!

- Steve

[Sparky]

It looks as though they may be too far from human housing. The PMCA guidelines specify 30-120 feet (min. - max.) Being that Northern range martins are picky about nesting sites, I would take a look and evaluate the distance from your house or neighbor's houses. The distance from trees seems OK at 40' minimums.

[Guest]

Daryl,

Let me begin by saying that like you I have been trying for many years to establish a martin colony at my home with no luck. Michigan has proven to be a difficult area to establish new colonies in recent years and I imagine the same may be true in your area.

I think the very first thing to remember is there is no single magic bullet for attracting martins. If there was then frustrated wanna-bes like you and I would not exist. I wish there was a simple single answer!

While there are many good suggestions put forth by existing martin hosts I think the most important idea a particular host might offer just happens to be the last thing they added or changed prior to their becoming successful hosts. In reality I believe you should follow the general advice available on this and similar sites, use some variety, and you'll still need at least a cup and a half of good luck added in. In other words, I think there is a lot of good advice available, but not many hard set rules.

In Michigan one of the most common factors for successful martin sites appears related to proximity to a large body of water (the Great lakes or large inland lakes). There are some very successful Michigan martin hosts that live on lakes, and yet their property is populated with large mature trees. Except for a bit of beach area where the colonies are located, trees are very close to the colonies on one side, a large body of water exists on the other. Since most people lack the means of creating a large body of water this is a factor that is hard to change and what you got is what you got. This doesn't mean you can't attract martins without a body of water nearby, but I do think it has a strong bearing on how difficult the task will be.

In Michigan and other northern areas many hosts report what they believe is a martin preference to modern wooden housing (Northstar or T-14 style) so you are good on that factor. I personally don't think that the proximity of trees on the site you show in your photos is a major factor if most other variables are good. Having said that, moving the housing around may produce a new level of variety that might just change the luck factor. Maybe you should move one house closer and one further from your house.

You didn't mention if you are playing Dawnsong at your place, but that would be a major omition if you are not. The fact that you are apparently successfully raising martins at your remote sites must help your chances as well since martins that you could attract to your home site must come from somewhere.

Good luck!

Jeff

[~Ray~Gingerich]

Your place looks much like mine as to location and type of buildings and distance to and size of the woods. I had martin houses up for over 30 years and never had any real sucess with martins until this year. What did I do? I spent the fall and winter cutting trees down, I made the place appear as open and wide as possible, my priority was to get the woods as far away as possible. I set up a new trio house past the recommended distance at 200 ft. from my house and at the very edge of a small pond I put in several years ago. I have a nest in my trio and in a t-14 and have visiting martins everyday. I would get those houses as far away from the woods as possible even if it's at the very edge of your property. Wish you the best

[Daryl Lindstrom - MN]

Thanks for your input!

Ray, CONGRATS on the nesting martins!!! Do you have any pics of your site / before and after?

I also think my best shot is to get the housing away from the woods as much as possible. I don't put much weight on the "putting the house close to human housing" guideline. Some of my public sites are even further from human housing than my home site. My martin housing is actually on my neighbor's land! The spot I plan on moving the housing to is the furthest I can get them from the woods! Hopefully next year, year #9, will finally be THE year!

[Guest]

I too would suggest that you move at least one house close to your home.

My three PM houses are less than 20 feet from my home and they were 100% full this season. I am now host to a mini roost of almost 200 PMs living in the three pine trees towering above the houses. Some of them drop down and visit the houses a couple of times a day; I think these are the birds that were born in these houses.

[Guest]

I don't see any water in the aerial photo. How far is it to water and is the water very close to the woods?

[djmains]

I don't see anything wrong with putting the housing in your side yard they say anywhere from 40ft to nor more than 120 foot from human activity because the martins feel protected and if you would have visitors that like the place don't move anything they don't like new housing and they don't seem to like their housing changed or rearranged so put it out there in the open and they will find it and leave everything open until late in september. I tried for four years and finally got two pair this year one thing they really don't like is encroachment I had housing on the side of my house with a big tree in the front yard after I removed that tree they settled in but I had visitors in 2005,2006 had a pair nest and 2007 activity and 2008 finally happened so as they tell me be patient and they will come good luck.

[Guest]

Darryl,
I think you hit the nail on the head when you talked about installing the same housing as the successful colonies around you. My observations this year have convinced me that I will not get any martins to stay until I do that here. The males had no problems with my housing--I had both last year's subbie and a new subbie--they both were very loyal to my site and brought countless visitors over during the spring and early summer. Every female they brought over rejected my housing, and I am convinced that it was because my housing was different. If I were you, I'd leave the current poles where they are and add one pole closer to your house, and put a T-14 with some gourds under it. If there is a large area between the two set-ups, I'd add a very tall perch pole---higher than the housing and have your oyster shell tray on that.

Good luck---hopefully next year will THE year for all of us wannabees.

[Guest]

Is how long it took me. Now my colony here in Wisconsin is thriving. But, I did put up new housing. I have gourds, but put up a new Coates. My martins are use to the gourds and prefer the gourds. Only one pair is nesting in the Coates. I am sure that will change with time. Dude, I think it is mostly luck mixed with perserverence. In the south they have so many damn martins that the proximity guidelines can be tweeked. I believe up north, like here, you have to stick to the guidelines for the best chance. I prefer the place where you are going to move the houses to over where there they are. Why ? I don't like the tree line. Scary. Looks like its full of owls and hawks. Just kidding. There appears to be nothing wrong with your site other than martins stopping to investigate and deciding to stay for the summer. Try digging a pond. Looks like you have the room. Just a half or quarter acre scrape.Give it a whirl it may do the trick. Good luck.

[Donnie Hurdt MN]

Daryl, if my site was as open as yours I would be a happy boy. I have trees on all sides of my site thats why I dont have any martins yet. I do get a few visiters now and then but none stay long. when my neighbors sites fill up more my chances should be better. I do offer the same housing as my neighbors and this year I have about a dozen of my gourds at their sites and all but one are taken with anywhere from three to six eggs/babies in them.
Keep trying, dont ever give up, some day they will stay.

[Guest]

I understand your frustration. I live in Pennsylvania, in an area with a lot of martin colonies. I have everything set up perfectly, and have had martin visitors over the last eight years, but none that have moved in. This weekend, I went to a nearby fishery and noticed he had martins at his large pond. The owner told me that he used to have the martin houses near his house with no luck. He said that when he was putting the houses up at the dock, they were fighting for the compartments as he was raising the house.

Although my place is perfect, everything is set up to the guidelines, I'm beginning to think that simply given a choice, the martins will go to the places that have water. I'm not very far from several large ponds, but I only have a small man-made watergarden (11' x 16') that is clearly not big enough to be attractive. As long as other people keep adding housing when their colony is full, I guess I shouldn't be too optomistic about my chances.

[Guest]

Daryl,

As this post points out so well, there really is not one single theory or proven technique for establishing a martin colony. Some ideas directly conflict with others and different martin hosts find conflicting sets of circumstances exist at their particular site.

From your post your are already aware of much of the generally accepted theories of attracting (and colonizing) martins. I think the only thing you can do now is to continue to offer a variety of housing and sites and pray to the martin lottery gods.

If you are like myself (and many other wanna-bes) it is maddening to continue to work at attracting martins year after year. Not satisfied to rely purely on luck we are continually seeking more ways that we can enhance our chances of success. At some point I imagine that people like us have to realize that we have most of the main bases covered and it comes down to tweaking what we already have and waiting.

Good luck with your site. I wish I knew of a sure-fire suggestion I could give to you, but then I would already have used it myself.

Jeff

[Daryl Lindstrom - MN]

Thanks everyone!

I've decided to go ahead and move the housing closer to the field and further from the woods. I've also decided to change my housing so it is the exact same as my five other established colonies located in the area.

My site is not on a lake or a river. However, there is a decently sized pond to the north of the site. The pond is about 1/4 mile away. It looks as though it should be plenty big enough for drinking and bathing??? There is also a lake that is about 2.5 miles away...perhaps too far to be of any benefit?

After my public colonies begin to fill up, I suspect some of the "over flow" will eventually find my home site.

[bwenger]

Daryl,

Thanks for all that you do to the various martin sites that you take care of. We all appreciate it.

I have been trying now for 4 years, and although I meet the supposed requirements, I have trouble getting a female to stay with the various males that have been happy with my site. I have an acre of ground and most of it is open. Across the street from me, is several acres of woods that have a thick ground cover, which harbors many sparrows. I believe this is my main problem. I had a pair stay for 3 weeks this year before they moved on. I believe a pair of HS nesting in the same T14 section made the decision for them. Since I am there only on weekends, and was away on vacation this year at that time, I may have blew my chance to get that first pair to nest by not being around to stop the sparrows from nesting.

I also have some tall trees on my neighbors property which do not help my case. I can imagine that a hawk can sit up there, even at 40-60 yards away, and be on the martins before they would know it.

My plans for 2009 is to cut a maple tree down that will provide probably 75' of free area around the T14 and to cut down the last pine tree on my property to eliminate that as a nesting tree as well. This will put the T14 about 50 feet from our house.

Good luck in 2009!

Bill